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Tampa City Council

Thursday, April 24, 2014

9:00 a.m. Workshop

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9:05:00 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: City Council is called to order.

09:05:02 Chair yields to Mrs. Lisa Montelione.

09:05:05 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

09:05:09 This morning I would like to recognize Pastor Cornelius

09:05:14 Hamilton.

09:05:16 Pastor Hamilton has forged a new identity as a Tampa

09:05:21 Samaritan, a generous God-fearing man feeding the homeless

09:05:25 food at the Salvation Army every Sunday and a small time

09:05:28 business owner at Big Brews Barbecue Shop.

09:05:33 Nobody is going to comment on that?

09:05:36 [ Laughter ]

09:05:36 I was waiting.

09:05:38 However, it's his pastoral sessions that make him touch the

09:05:45 hearts of the community.

09:05:46 He too was once a troubled kid in and out of prison in the

09:05:49 jail system.

09:05:50 However he used that same energy and turned it into

09:05:52 something positive by helping the community, feeding the

09:05:55 homeless, and being more involved in church and his love

09:05:59 with God.

09:06:00 His appearance is what makes him special, his long dreaded

09:06:05 hair, 300-plus pounds, and a heart of gold that can change

09:06:10 the world.

09:06:11 In the near future he plans on opening a Salvation Army

09:06:13 center to help the homeless and surrounding community to

09:06:17 better themselves and teach them how to approach the

09:06:19 fundamentals of living and maintaining a good life.

09:06:22 We ask that you take the time to read his reviews from some

09:06:26 of the most prominent newspapers such as TBT, Florida

09:06:29 sentinel and "Tampa Bay Times" to see the great things that

09:06:33 he has done for the community.

09:06:36 It's my driving destiny to see that other itself make their

09:06:39 destiny.

09:06:40 Welcome, pastor.

09:06:41 >> With his grace we can do all things in Christ who

09:06:53 strengthens us.

09:06:54 My prayer this morning, for any words, thoughts or deeds

09:07:03 that have been displeasing to you and I ask you to watch my

09:07:07 body, soul and spirit with the blood of Jesus.




09:07:10 I curse everything corruptible the seed that has been

09:07:15 planted overnight that is not of Christ Jesus and I command

09:07:19 it to wither and die so you may bear fruit for your glory,

09:07:24 Jesus.

09:07:25 In clean spirit that has attached itself to me overnight and

09:07:29 send it back to the places in the name of Jesus.

09:07:44 Holy Spirit, come help me pray that I put on the whole armor

09:07:48 of God, the helmet of salvation, the breastplate of

09:07:50 righteousness, to share the faith, the sword of spirit, the

09:07:54 belt of truth and the shoes for the direction and the places

09:07:59 that you want me to go.

09:08:04 Over my memories, my possessions, my spirit, my soul, my

09:08:07 body, my past, and I surrender myself to your perfect will.

09:08:14 Bind me, break me, and do whatever that needs to be done to

09:08:18 me to get me closer to you, Lord.

09:08:20 Father, I come to you with all the glory, Lord, and fulfill

09:08:26 the depth Lord.

09:08:27 So, Father, I pray that God this morning, heavenly father,

09:08:39 because in your words, all things are possible, Lord,

09:08:43 heavenly father, not some things but all things, Lord

09:08:46 heavenly father, and who you be for me, who can be against

09:08:51 me, Lord heavenly father?

09:08:56 Your will be done.

09:08:57 In your precious son's name, amen.

09:09:00 Now let's get ready for the pledge of allegiance.




09:09:04 (Pledge of Allegiance)

09:09:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.

09:09:25 Item number 1.

09:09:29 Roll call.

09:09:30 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Here.

09:09:37 >>FRANK REDDICK: Here.

09:09:42 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Here.

09:09:44 >>HARRY COHEN: Here.

09:09:45 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Here.

09:09:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.

09:09:48 First item is police Officer of the Month by Mr. Reddick and

09:09:57 Chief Castor.

09:09:58 >>FRANK REDDICK: Good morning.

09:10:03 It's an honor to stand here with Officer of the Month for

09:10:08 April 2014.

09:10:12 I turn it over to the chief.

09:10:14 >> Good morning, council.

09:10:16 Again a pleasure of mine to stand before you once a month

09:10:19 and bring you the best and brightest of the Tampa Police

09:10:21 Department, Charles Hascott who we know as Chuck.

09:10:28 He's been with us about 12 years and he's been a supervisor

09:10:31 for almost two years now.

09:10:33 First a street corporal with ROC and now as a detective, and

09:10:39 he does an amazing job.

09:10:41 Not only is he an outstanding police officer but he is a




09:10:45 great leader as well who distinguished himself as such, in

09:10:49 such a short time, and his very proud major back here, Paul

09:10:54 Driscoll, who will probably try to take credit for some of

09:10:58 the things he's done.

09:11:00 [ Laughter ]

09:11:00 Actually, I will give you three of the instances that

09:11:03 highlight the things that he does every day.

09:11:06 Some time back, there was a young mother who was dropping

09:11:09 her child off at the grandmother's house prior to going off

09:11:13 to work.

09:11:14 A suspect came up to her, pointed a gun, and demanded her

09:11:18 vehicle. In fear for her life she complied and the suspect

09:11:23 carjacked the vehicle.

09:11:25 Chuck was given the case.

09:11:27 He gathered the pertinent facts and obtained video

09:11:30 surveillance showing the suspect using the stolen credit

09:11:33 card.

09:11:33 He was able to determine the location of the stolen property

09:11:37 belonging to the victim, and through interviews and social

09:11:41 media, he was able to identify that suspect who was also a

09:11:47 convicted felon.

09:11:48 He obtained a warrant for him and he was arrested.

09:11:51 Three hours later -- now, he did all of that and arrested

09:11:54 the individual within three hours.

09:11:55 Three hours later, there were shots fired into the victim's




09:11:59 apartment, either in retaliation or in an attempt to

09:12:04 intimidate the victim, and again -- and those shots nearly

09:12:11 missed the five month old baby that was inside that

09:12:14 apartment.

09:12:14 Chuck investigated thoroughly and tried to -- he developed a

09:12:19 suspect, person of interest, but he didn't have enough to

09:12:21 charge him at that time.

09:12:22 Now, several months later, he learned that there was a

09:12:26 shooting suspect that had been arrested by the Hillsborough

09:12:28 County sheriff's office, and at the time of his arrest he

09:12:32 was in possession of a .45 caliber firearm which was the

09:12:38 same type of weapon used in this drive-by shooting.

09:12:41 Quick coordination on Chuck's part led to that firearm being

09:12:46 tested and he was able to confirm that the bullets from that

09:12:50 drive-by shooting came from that particular firearm, and he

09:12:53 was able to level charges in that particular case.

09:12:57 That's incredible police work.

09:12:59 Then shortly thereafter, or at the beginning of this year,

09:13:03 there were several burglaries throughout the Hillsborough

09:13:05 County area, City of Tampa and Hillsborough County, where

09:13:10 sieves and ATMs were being taken.

09:13:13 There were three such burglaries in district 1 which is

09:13:16 Chuck's area of responsibility, and a van was stolen.

09:13:20 All of these things were related.

09:13:22 So detective Hascott volunteered to work all these cases and




09:13:27 respond to be the location where the stolen van had been

09:13:30 recovered.

09:13:32 The vehicle was processed by crime scene technicians but

09:13:35 there weren't any leads obtained at that time.

09:13:38 So Chuck stayed on scene and did very in-depth neighborhood

09:13:43 survey and came up with a person of interest.

09:13:47 He developed -- there was another burglary investigation,

09:13:53 also, in which surveillance was done.

09:13:56 So the follow-up to the positive identification of the

09:14:00 getaway vehicle used in several of these commercial

09:14:03 burglaries, and some suspects were identified.

09:14:06 He coordinated a detailed surveillance plan with our ROC

09:14:10 squad, Rapid Offender Control squad, and they executed it.

09:14:14 Within one week identified the main suspect along with a

09:14:20 couple other known suspects, a commercial burglary, arrested

09:14:24 all of them on scene and put this crime spree to a stop.

09:14:27 So again, an example of outstanding police work.

09:14:30 This is the one that warms the heart of the police chief.

09:14:34 I'll tell you what, this is outstanding police work this

09:14:39 next one. In December 2013 Chuck investigated a bank

09:14:43 robbery.

09:14:43 The armed and disguised suspect used a stolen van during the

09:14:47 robbery.

09:14:47 Initially there were no solid leads that were developed, but

09:14:50 the owner of that stolen vehicle received a toll violation




09:14:54 where somebody had gone through one of the toll booths and

09:14:59 not paid on the Crosstown expressway.

09:15:01 So Chuck took all of that information, and he asked for the

09:15:04 records from the Crosstown expressway for every vehicle that

09:15:08 had gone through this particular toll booth during a

09:15:12 specific period of time, and based on researching all of

09:15:15 that data that he got, there was one vehicle that was

09:15:18 flagged that happened to be the son of the registered owner

09:15:23 was identified as a suspect in that particular bank robbery.

09:15:27 But again he didn't have enough to arrest him on that

09:15:32 particular violation.

09:15:33 Then again on March 14th there was a bank robbery in

09:15:37 South Tampa where two marked men, one armed with a sub

09:15:41 machine gun type firearm, went in and robbed this bank.

09:15:45 Noting that the detail provided by Chuck Hascott, ROC unit

09:15:52 began to surveil that suspect's and lo and behold here come

09:15:59 the two bank robbers.

09:16:00 So based on the outstanding work that Chuck Hascott had

09:16:04 done, we were able to arrest them, get all the money back,

09:16:07 and seize the firearms that they used in that bank robbery.

09:16:10 And that is amazing police work.

09:16:12 So for all of that and everything he does on a daily basis,

09:16:16 and his leadership, he is being recognized as the Tampa

09:16:20 Police Department's Officer of the Month for March 2014.

09:16:24 [ Applause ]




09:16:34 >>FRANK REDDICK: On behalf of Tampa City Council we would

09:16:36 like to present you this commendation for being selected as

09:16:39 Officer of the Month for the month of April 2014.

09:16:42 Congratulations.

09:16:45 >> Thank you very much, sir.

09:16:46 [ Applause ]

09:16:53 >> I'm president of the Tampa police benevolent association.

09:17:11 With me is officer Agello.

09:17:17 On behalf of the PBA we would like to thank Chuck for his

09:17:22 work in protecting the citizens of the City of Tampa, and

09:17:29 making the rest of the organization, members of the Tampa

09:17:33 PBA, look really good.

09:17:35 I would like to present this gift in honor of that.

09:17:49 >> Michael Kilgore, restaurant group, a gift certificate for

09:17:55 $100 good for any of the restaurants.

09:17:58 Thank you for what you do.

09:17:59 >> Jill Latecki.

09:18:09 You may have seen in the news we were named as up with of

09:18:12 the 15 most spectacular theaters.

09:18:20 And we would like to present one of the most spectacular

09:18:24 officers with tickets.

09:18:26 >> Joe Durkin, Bright House networks.

09:18:32 Congratulations.

09:18:34 From all your friends at Bright House, one month

09:18:37 complimentary service of all our services.




09:18:49 >> Steve Stickley representing Stepps Towing service on

09:18:53 behalf of Jim, Judy and Todd Stepp, appreciation for a job

09:18:57 well done, and also gift card to Lee Roy Selmon.

09:19:06 >> Frank DeSoto representing Bill Currie Ford and the Currie

09:19:12 family.

09:19:12 We are extremely proud to present you with this watch in

09:19:14 recognition of a job well done.

09:19:16 Thank you very much for everything you do.

09:19:23 >> I'm with the Straz Center for the Performing Arts.

09:19:29 We would like to give you these tickets and thank you for

09:19:35 your service.

09:19:38 >> We would like to offer you $50 off the best pulled pork,

09:19:46 Big Brews barbecue.

09:19:51 Also, car washes for free.

09:19:56 $50 off anything you want.

09:19:57 >>STEVE MICHELINI: We are going to try to feed that machine

09:20:11 that you have here.

09:20:13 Do you like Mediterranean food?

09:20:17 >> I do.

09:20:17 >> Well, Bibalow's would like to treat you to your choice,

09:20:21 lunch or dinner for you and a companion.

09:20:23 And you can call and go anytime you like.

09:20:30 Then you can get your picture taken.

09:20:31 Do you want that before or after you eat?

09:20:34 >> Probably before.




09:20:35 >>STEVE MICHELINI: We are going to provide you with a

09:20:37 portrait package so you and your friends can have pictures

09:20:44 taken and work out beforehand and a nice shower, cleaned up.

09:20:47 There you go.

09:20:48 Enjoy yourself and thank you for what you do.

09:20:52 That's the diligence of the police department and their

09:20:55 employees is beyond belief.

09:20:57 As the chief has said, they continue to impress all of us in

09:21:00 our community and they always help us.

09:21:04 Anytime that we have called upon them, they have been there

09:21:06 for us and we appreciate it.

09:21:07 Thank you.

09:21:07 >> Thank you, sir.

09:21:11 Appreciate it.

09:21:13 Well, this is so nice.

09:21:14 I really, really appreciate it.

09:21:18 All I can say is I work for a great city and a great

09:21:22 department, and I enjoy my job thoroughly.

09:21:26 And there's nothing I like more than to get a good lead on a

09:21:30 case and work with the other officers, detectives, and the

09:21:34 ROC squad to see it threw to the end.

09:21:40 I can't thank everybody enough.

09:21:43 I really appreciate it.

09:21:44 Thank you very much.

09:21:45 [ Applause ]




09:21:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Enjoy your popcorn.

09:21:59 Mr. Reddick will now also do the presentation, commendation

09:22:11 for firefighter of the quarter, along with Chief Holder.

09:22:26 >>FRANK REDDICK: Good morning again.

09:22:28 It's an honor to stand before you with Tampa fire department

09:22:33 firefighter of the quarter for April 2014.

09:22:36 Chief.

09:22:36 >> CHIEF HOLDER: Thank you, Councilman.

09:22:44 Our firefighter of the quarter, we are proud to present to

09:22:47 you an individual who absolutely really embellishes and

09:22:53 holds and embraces everything about the true merits of a

09:22:58 firefighter, par a medic.

09:23:01 Fire captain Troy Jones has been on the Tampa fire

09:23:04 department for almost 16 years.

09:23:06 But in those 16 years he has really, really demonstrated

09:23:11 exceptional, exceptional array of accomplishments, and fire

09:23:19 station number 1, where everything happens down there, and

09:23:24 during this process, Troy has continually grown, worked with

09:23:29 his entire team to become one of the best of the best.

09:23:32 When it comes to our fire company officers, there's no

09:23:36 position on this job that's more important than fire

09:23:40 captain, who is responsible for mentoring, growing,

09:23:43 developing, and etching the core value of fire rescue of

09:23:50 every new member that comes in, and they cannot do that if

09:23:55 they don't have the requisite skills that do that.




09:24:02 Everyone knows that the City of Tampa and the port of Tampa

09:24:06 have 64% of all of the Haz-Mat in the State of Florida.

09:24:11 Because of the 85% of what of we do, accomplished paramedic

09:24:19 and became a paramedic, not only all the requisite skills to

09:24:26 be a good medic but also at fire station number 3 which is

09:24:30 our critical care transport unit which many of our hospitals

09:24:33 rely on those who have a very different field set than the

09:24:38 rest in the field to be able to do critical transport taking

09:24:44 patients from one medical facility to another specialized

09:24:47 medical facility and being able to manage those issues.

09:24:51 On top of that he became a fire instructor.

09:24:54 He is one of the lead instructors for the City of Tampa, and

09:24:56 with respect to the programs that we are in a partnership as

09:25:01 well to grow and groom new candidates as they come in to

09:25:05 help them understand the dynamics of firefighting and

09:25:09 emergency response, and trained instructor taking these

09:25:15 persons into what, put them in the hottest, most intense

09:25:22 environments to really see if they have in mettle to become

09:25:28 what they are, and then away from that, doing all these

09:25:32 things with the City of Tampa and fire rescue, he takes time

09:25:37 to special needs group for kids with special needs, and he

09:25:43 goes out and provides services, fitness initiatives, and

09:25:52 gives them some time off from working with those kids and

09:25:56 their down time.

09:25:59 He volunteers at YMCA where-works with the swimming program




09:26:03 up there, and with that he has a very accomplished young

09:26:10 son, a very good swimmer at the YMCA as well.

09:26:14 So we are very, very proud of all of the things that captain

09:26:17 Troy Jones does, and every respective part of this community

09:26:25 from fire station downtown, then goes to Haz-Mat and does

09:26:30 everything over there, and then moving over to Busch gardens

09:26:38 area where he was with engine company over there, and then

09:26:41 when he became a captain, referred to what we refer to as

09:26:45 house of pain, station number 11, and he was there for a

09:26:48 while.

09:26:49 Everybody knows the history of that one.

09:26:51 And now he's in West Tampa as a captain on one of the five

09:26:55 aerial platforms, a truck company that we have.

09:27:02 We have so few of those units.

09:27:04 The persons assigned to those units have to be the best as

09:27:09 McGwyver, because they absolutely make things happen, and

09:27:16 when the engine property calls them they have to make a very

09:27:22 unique type of decision and they make those things happen on

09:27:24 a daily basis.

09:27:26 For that and so many other things that captain Troy Jones

09:27:29 day in and day out.

09:27:30 And the way he represents this profession, and this

09:27:33 community, and we have obviously as his peers voted on him

09:27:41 to be Tampa Fire Rescue's firefighter of the quarter.

09:27:45 [ Applause ]




09:27:53 Troy is accompanied here this morning by his lovely wife

09:27:56 Chantal, by his young son Nathan, his daughter Hanna, and a

09:28:01 very, very dear friend of mine and one of the finest deputy

09:28:05 chiefs that this community has ever had, retired deputy fire

09:28:10 chief Terry Jones and his lovely wife and Troy's mother

09:28:15 Linda.

09:28:24 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, captain, for all you do. On

09:28:26 behalf of Tampa City Council we would like to present you

09:28:29 this commendation for being chosen Tampa firefighter of the

09:28:33 quarter April 2014.

09:28:38 We also have some goodies as well.

09:28:50 >> Joe Durkin, Bright House networks.

09:29:06 Congratulations.

09:29:06 You really represent an outstanding fire department.

09:29:09 I want to thank you for your service.

09:29:11 Three months complimentary services of everything Bright

09:29:14 House offers to make your life a lot easier.

09:29:17 >> Jill Latecki with Tampa that's right.

09:29:30 Thousand dollared theaters always love having firefighters

09:29:33 around.

09:29:34 This is for you and your wife, an annual membership.

09:29:36 >> Stepp's towing service on behalf of Jim, Judy, Todd

09:29:49 Stepp, a smoke token of our appreciation for a job well

09:29:53 done.

09:29:53 And a gift card to Lee Roy Selmon's.




09:29:57 >> Michael Kilgore, Gonzmart family, Columbia restaurant

09:30:04 group, to take your entire family to one of the seven

09:30:08 restaurants in Florida.

09:30:09 Thanks for what you do.

09:30:10 >> Jim Carson, Bill Currie Ford.

09:30:16 On behalf of Bill Currie Ford family, congratulations.

09:30:20 A $100 gift certificate.

09:30:27 >> Straz Center for the performing arts.

09:30:32 Thank you very much for all your service.

09:30:37 >> Chris Jackson, two prosperity, want to offer you again

09:30:44 $50 off, also three car washes.

09:30:47 I want to thank you for stepping up and being somebody

09:30:51 else's hero.

09:30:54 Thank you so much.

09:30:55 >>STEVE MICHELINI: You're a tall guy.

09:31:02 Not as big as the other guy who was here.

09:31:04 But I'm sure you stand just as tall in this community,

09:31:07 though.

09:31:07 >> I hope so.

09:31:08 I try to.

09:31:09 >> For all of those firefighters and fire rescue people that

09:31:12 are the other line of defense -- notice I didn't say second

09:31:15 line of defense -- other line of defense, a different kind

09:31:17 of defense of that we all rely upon.

09:31:20 On behalf of BIBALOW cafe we would like you and your family




09:31:26 to enjoy lunch or dinner.

09:31:28 And this is for the kids.

09:31:29 I am not going to give this to you.

09:31:32 You get to have your picture taken.

09:31:34 How about that?

09:31:35 Such a fine looking young family.

09:31:40 So, anyway, we congratulate you for what you do for this

09:31:43 community.

09:31:44 We appreciate that every day.

09:31:46 And we know that fire rescue is always on the job.

09:31:49 So congratulations.

09:31:50 And thank you again.

09:31:51 >> Thank you very much.

09:31:59 I'm very humbled and honored to be here.

09:32:01 I really do consider it a privilege just to be a member of

09:32:04 Tampa Fire Rescue, and to be able to serve the citizens of

09:32:08 Tampa, to be recognized in this capacity by my peers is very

09:32:13 honoring to me, and I'm very appreciative.

09:32:16 The best part of my job is I get to work with incredible

09:32:19 people every day.

09:32:22 Success is a lot easier when you are in the right

09:32:25 environment.

09:32:25 And the commitment, dedication, the men and women of fire

09:32:28 Tampa rescue to help me be the best that I can be and I hope

09:32:32 that I can continue to improve throughout the rest of my




09:32:34 career.

09:32:37 My lovely p wife for her love and support.

09:32:40 I couldn't do this without her.

09:32:42 My kids.

09:32:43 Mother and father for the example that they always set for

09:32:46 me.

09:32:46 And I can never thank them enough.

09:32:49 City Council for your stewardship of the city.

09:32:51 And the support of our department, chief forward, all the

09:33:01 men and women of Tampa Fire Rescue for their dedication and

09:33:04 service.

09:33:05 My crew on "A" shift, great people and really do appreciate

09:33:11 them every day, and anyone else who has taken the time to

09:33:15 invest in me and mentor me, I appreciate it.

09:33:17 Thank you very much.

09:33:18 Very honored and humbled and very appreciative.

09:33:21 Thank you very much.

09:33:24 [ Applause ]

09:34:18 >>FRANK REDDICK: Mr. Chairman, this is National Poet Month

09:34:28 and we have one of the greatest poets that ever lived in the

09:34:30 city, the state and part of this country.

09:34:34 He is with us this morning and we would like to recognize

09:34:37 him with his wife, Joanna, and would you please join me as I

09:34:43 bring before you Poet Laureate, Mr. James Tokley.

09:35:02 >> Good morning, my friends.




09:35:03 I am indeed honored to be here with you.

09:35:08 I have written a piece entitled A Poet Laureate's Report.

09:35:17 For words that ring like a violin sings

09:35:21 A light to inspire both commoners and kings

09:35:25 Have I, your laureate, sought to set before the ears of the

09:35:32 many I have met

09:35:33 And by your leave in in your name my words have gone in

09:35:36 global fame

09:35:38 In the hearts of them who may have heard or seen the

09:35:42 monument of my words

09:35:45 Yet here within this sacred room, my right to be was given

09:35:50 first bloom

09:35:52 To bid good morning to the voices that proclaimed the

09:35:56 people's choice

09:35:57 And from the seeds that were first sewn I have made your

09:36:03 covenant my own

09:36:05 By speaking in a metaphoric rhyme about the issues of our

09:36:09 time

09:36:11 In this great municipality with its wondrous true diversity

09:36:19 From inaugural poems where new days have dawned to

09:36:22 historical songs where what was is now gone

09:36:25 To poems of days that are yet to be

09:36:31 My pen has painted what it could see

09:36:34 And will still see, though future days may darken, and two

09:36:39 feet of clay may run slower, yet this poet's mind has




09:36:45 eyesight that will not grow blind

09:36:49 For in my thoughts and dreams there dwell a thousand stories

09:36:54 yet to tell

09:36:55 Of a town and county in whose eyes the poetry of youth will

09:37:01 always rise

09:37:04 So for the laureates yet to come, I give you thanks as your

09:37:09 first one and trust that you will always see the need for

09:37:14 the arts of poetry.

09:37:20 Thank you.

09:37:21 Thank you for all you have given me, the opportunity to show

09:37:24 the world that words have power.

09:37:32 May the people of this city continue to bless you.

09:37:38 [ Applause ]

09:37:40 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much, Mr. Tokley.

09:37:51 Very well said.

09:37:52 We now go to the workshops, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11.

09:37:59 8, 9, 10 and 11 I made up.

09:38:03 These workshops, after we have A and B, so you are allowed

09:38:07 to speak three minutes on A and three minutes on B since

09:38:11 they are two different sections, then the others, also.

09:38:16 So three minutes.

09:38:17 I need a motion to open the workshops.

09:38:19 I have a motion by Mrs. Montelione, seconded by Mr. Cohen.

09:38:22 All in favor of the motion indicate by saying aye.

09:38:24 Opposed nay.




09:38:25 The ayes have it unanimously.

09:38:27 Item number 3, Mr. Shelby.

09:38:28 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Good morning, Mr. Chairman, members of

09:38:45 City Council.

09:38:46 For the record I'm Martin Shelby, the City Council attorney.

09:38:50 I'm here on item number 3, part A, with a report for your

09:38:58 review being reverted back to the SU-II process pertaining

09:39:05 to alcoholic beverages.

09:39:10 And toward that end, members of council, my report, I

09:39:15 expect, to take no more than 15 minutes, 20 minutes.

09:39:20 I would be happy to get more in-depth if you wish.

09:39:23 But my hope is that with council's permission I be allowed

09:39:27 to give my report, and if you could hold your comments and

09:39:30 questions till the end, I would be more than happy to

09:39:32 address them.

09:39:35 It is my hope that at the conclusion of today's workshop,

09:39:42 City Council will reach a consensus on the issue and provide

09:39:47 clarity of direction to the staff to return with options and

09:39:52 recommendations to address your specific concerns, and

09:39:57 toward that end, council, in preparation for this workshop,

09:40:00 I have prepared and distributed to you my attempt at a

09:40:05 compendium.

09:40:07 I provided to you a compilation for improper review of the

09:40:13 pertinent sections of the Tampa code of ordinances along the

09:40:22 last page of one section of Florida statute, but in effect,




09:40:27 council, you began improper discussion with alcoholic

09:40:29 beverages last week, as you know.

09:40:32 And this is the opportunity to discuss those issues, and

09:40:39 hopefully at the end reach a consensus.

09:40:43 There were some good comments.

09:40:45 I really appreciated the comments that City Council members

09:40:48 made last week and I don't have them written in front of me

09:40:51 but I remember them.

09:40:52 I wrote them down at the time because they were rather

09:40:54 significant.

09:40:55 And one thing that Councilman Cohen alluded to is you have

09:41:01 to work with where you are now with the tools that you have

09:41:05 now, words to that effect.

09:41:07 You have to adapt, I think was the term he used, to the

09:41:10 situations as they are.

09:41:12 'N and towards that end what MS goal was in providing you

09:41:15 this compilation is to have for you, in front of you, your

09:41:20 tool box.

09:41:20 This in effect is your tool box.

09:41:23 These are the tools that have been created that apply to the

09:41:26 alcoholic special use process.

09:41:28 Now, there are also sections within the code of ordinances

09:41:31 that are contained within here that apply to other

09:41:35 quasi-judicial proceedings, other land uses, things like the

09:41:40 notice provisions.




09:41:41 That's all in here.

09:41:43 And things like the application process.

09:41:46 That's in here.

09:41:47 So you have the opportunity to look at, in black and white,

09:41:55 the processes and the criteria that are used with special

09:41:59 use process.

09:42:00 And that's where we are now.

09:42:01 This is where you are now.

09:42:03 As a matter of fact, I compiled this using UNI code, which

09:42:07 is the organization that publishes and posts the code of

09:42:12 ordinances, and I was informed by Ms. Coyle just this past

09:42:16 Tuesday that there was an error in the definition section in

09:42:20 the code that has just been corrected this past Monday.

09:42:24 So towards that end, what I would like to do is I would like

09:42:27 to give each of you a copy to keep with you for that

09:42:37 compilation.

09:42:38 There you go.

09:42:43 To gun my report I prefer back to the original motion.

09:42:59 And it's a discussion, a report pertaining to the SU-I being

09:43:06 referred back to the previous SU-II process.

09:43:10 Now, when you talk about the process being changed, the

09:43:14 SU-1, your recollection for the public information, the SU-1

09:43:21 process is an administrative approval.

09:43:23 There is no notice.

09:43:24 There is no public notice.




09:43:25 There is no public hearing.

09:43:27 And if it is a certain type of use or certain class of

09:43:32 business, a certain category, a certain criteria, it is

09:43:36 administratively approved.

09:43:38 The SU-II process is if it doesn't meet the criteria and a

09:43:46 waiver is required, or in other certain categories it goes

09:43:49 to a public hearing before City Council, with notice to the

09:43:53 community, and an opportunity to be heard.

09:43:55 And council is very familiar, obviously, with the SU-II

09:43:59 process.

09:44:04 In April of 2011, ordinance 2011-47 took effect, which

09:44:10 basically created categories and criteria for SU-1

09:44:20 processes, implemented those, and also by so doing created

09:44:26 new criterion that was applied to those SU-2 processes,

09:44:31 certain categories.

09:44:32 And we can go through those in the workbook.

09:44:39 What is interesting -- and it's important to begin with --

09:44:42 is that contained within the motion, there's an unanswered

09:44:47 question that needs to be addressed.

09:44:49 And the unanswered question in council's motion, no matter

09:44:54 how you answer it, raises additional issues, and that

09:44:57 question is this.

09:44:59 This ordinance, by the way, which I provided a copy for you

09:45:01 so you could see the underlying revisions to alcoholic

09:45:05 beverages since then, but this is the ordinance that really




09:45:08 changed the process.

09:45:09 But now we are going to change the process.

09:45:12 It's also changed the criteria.

09:45:14 So the question that's unanswered in your motion is if it is

09:45:20 council's intention to go back to an SU-II public hearing

09:45:25 process, under what criteria do you go back?

09:45:30 Do you stick solely with the process and keep the new

09:45:34 criteria?

09:45:35 Or do you go back to the criteria that existed before the

09:45:38 passage of this ordinance?

09:45:40 And as you recall, for the sake of simplicity, the ordinance

09:45:44 with regard to distance separation, under the old scheme was

09:45:49 pretty simple.

09:45:50 There was a distance separation of a thousand feet.

09:45:53 A thousand feet from residences, a thousand feet from

09:45:56 schools, and other institutional churches under other

09:45:59 institutional uses, a thousand feet from other alcoholic

09:46:02 beverage establishments.

09:46:06 So the question is, if you want to revert back to a public

09:46:13 hearing process, what criteria do you use?

09:46:17 And I am going to refresh your recollection.

09:46:19 A discussion at the time and a discussion that actually took

09:46:21 place in 2013 with this council, I provided for you in your

09:46:26 backup two maps of the four or five that Cathy Coyle had

09:46:33 provided to you for discussion purposes.




09:46:37 And see how that looks.

09:46:42 This is called the 1,000-foot buffer rule map.

09:46:50 Now, this is a map of alcoholic establishments that were

09:46:58 approved, and you can see by the shading, which is the

09:47:07 salmon colored areas, that if you apply the thousand foot

09:47:13 rules and wept back to the thousand foot rule, those areas

09:47:18 that are shaded salmon would be unable to obtain an

09:47:23 alcoholic beverage special use permit without a waiver.

09:47:31 So that is the first usual you.

09:47:33 And then we get into the question of how then should council

09:47:39 address waivers?

09:47:40 Now, it's interesting that -- I believe that took place in

09:47:46 1985, we went to the thousand foot rule.

09:47:49 In 1975, between 1975 and 1985, there was a 500-foot buffer

09:48:02 rule.

09:48:02 And you have these maps in front of you.

09:48:04 And you can see that even with a 500-foot buffer rule, if

09:48:13 that were the criteria, with those salmon colored shaded

09:48:18 areas, those locations would require waivers from the

09:48:22 distance criteria.

09:48:26 So if you go back to an SU-II public hearing process, with

09:48:34 the old criteria, one of two things is going to happen.

09:48:42 You will either, if you hold to the 1,000-foot buffer rule,

09:48:45 you will either preclude alcoholic beverages, special use

09:48:51 permits from being issued in those salmon colored areas, or




09:48:57 the second is you would then be granting waivers to every

09:49:06 conceivably public hearing that came before you.

09:49:11 Now, I think it's important as context for your

09:49:16 discussion -- and it's my hope that when I do my report and

09:49:25 answer any questions, I would like to get out of the way.

09:49:27 I would like to sit back down and let council discuss these

09:49:31 issues, because this is your only opportunity -- I'm wearing

09:49:37 a wireless MIC so I'm allowed to walk.

09:49:41 I can pace.

09:49:43 But my point is, you are governed by the sunshine law.

09:49:51 And regular meetings are very formal.

09:49:53 And you are in effect all facing out.

09:49:56 So you are in effect talking to the audience, which is a

09:49:59 difficult position.

09:49:59 But I'm hopeful, as I said, that council has the opportunity

09:50:03 to have a courteous and civil discourse with one another to

09:50:09 come to a consensus to resolve the issues that, by the way,

09:50:12 the most important thing, the place to begin, the place to

09:50:20 begin, and ultimately the place to end up, is for the Tampa

09:50:25 City Council to identify and to articulate the specific

09:50:35 concern that you want addressed.

09:50:42 And Chairman Miranda, at last week's meeting, said it very

09:50:45 succinctly, and he wrote it down.

09:50:49 He said referring to City Council City Council, he said --

09:50:52 and you can check the transcript -- but I wrote it down as




09:50:55 he said it, what are we trying to accomplish?

09:51:00 And this is council's opportunity at this workshop if it

09:51:03 chooses to take it to make that decision, to come to a

09:51:07 consensus, and then to give direction to staff to allow it

09:51:11 to be able to present with the options and recommendations,

09:51:16 if you select them, to resolve your concerns, because, as I

09:51:20 said, just with the process of going back to the old

09:51:24 criteria, that raises concerns and raises problems.

09:51:27 And I would like, if I have some time, just to get to the

09:51:31 problem of what is created when you have quasi-judicial

09:51:36 public hearings.

09:51:39 Public hearings, 20, 25 years ago, for quasi-judicial didn't

09:51:49 exist.

09:51:50 There was no distinction.

09:51:53 We lawyers throw out these terms, quasi-judicial, we throw

09:51:57 out competent, substantial evidence, but where does this

09:52:00 come from?

09:52:02 It came from the court.

09:52:03 It came from decisions.

09:52:04 It came from the law.

09:52:06 It came from things the court imposed upon you as a decision

09:52:11 making body that has to be adhered to.

09:52:14 Why?

09:52:15 Because otherwise, it violates private property rights.

09:52:22 And certain protections have been put in place initially to




09:52:25 afford private property rights to petitioners.

09:52:33 So what does that mean?

09:52:35 It means that the reality is the issuance of a special use

09:52:45 permit for the sale and consumption of alcoholic beverages

09:52:51 is not a political decision.

09:52:56 It is not a political decision.

09:53:02 And the minute it becomes a political decision, you have

09:53:06 potentially adversely affected somebody's private property

09:53:13 rights.

09:53:17 And sometimes it's hard to accept -- you know, the public

09:53:21 sees you as their elected representative.

09:53:25 That's the way the public sees you.

09:53:27 As they come in here to address you, what I think is

09:53:31 important in the context of this discussion of special use

09:53:34 permits, particularly in this instance with alcoholic

09:53:36 beverages, but I'm applying this to every quasi-judicial

09:53:41 land use decision, it is not, and it cannot be a political

09:53:47 decision.

09:53:48 It has to be based on evidence that's in the record, at a

09:53:53 public hearing, through staff report or through testimony,

09:53:57 and it has to be competent, substantial evidence.

09:54:01 You hear us throw that out.

09:54:03 Well, it has significance.

09:54:06 What is competent evidence?

09:54:07 People say what's competent evidence?




09:54:08 Competent evidence is evidence that's relevant to what you

09:54:15 have to decide and material to the issues and the criteria

09:54:18 that you have to address.

09:54:21 I would like you to turn to page 3, if you can.

09:54:26 I am going to do a little bit of reading, just to put things

09:54:29 into greater context for you.

09:54:38 Section 27-126 of your code talks about the special use,

09:54:43 procedures and requirements, and in part it says the

09:54:47 intent -- and this is the middle of A -- is to insure

09:54:53 consideration of the particular circumstances of each case,

09:54:57 and the establishment of such conditions and safeguards as

09:55:01 are reasonably necessary for the protection of the public

09:55:04 interest generally and of adjacent property, the

09:55:09 neighborhood, and the city as a whole.

09:55:13 That goes for whether it's an SU-I, administrative approval

09:55:17 or SU -- II public hearing.

09:55:19 Now, in establishing the special use --

09:55:24 (Bell sounds)

09:55:24 May I continue?

09:55:26 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I am going to give you five more minutes

09:55:28 and that's it.

09:55:29 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Okay.

09:55:29 I'll cut to the chase.

09:55:31 To insure consideration of a particular circumstance, I have

09:55:33 read that, but in establishing the special use permit system




09:55:38 to increase efficiency and reduce the time required for

09:55:41 processing applications by relating administrative

09:55:45 responsibilities and procedural requirements to the degree

09:55:48 of complexity and potential of the matters being considered.

09:55:52 Now, in this book, you also have the procedure to be able to

09:56:01 apply the particular criteria.

09:56:06 On page 4, section 27-127, are the classes of special use

09:56:12 permits, and that's on page 4.

09:56:16 And you will see that your tools are now that under the SU-1

09:56:19 process under B-1 are certain time frames and processes for

09:56:25 the zoning administrator.

09:56:26 Again no formal notice of hearing.

09:56:28 S-2, number 2, is the procedure for submission and

09:56:33 consideration by the City Council.

09:56:37 So the criteria itself is section 129, page 16.

09:56:47 And I am going to direct your attention to it in the

09:56:48 continue text of the public hearing.

09:56:51 You have 129-A, those in the general standards, and at the

09:56:56 end of it you see throws a sentence that says it shall be

09:56:58 the responsibility of the applicant to present evidence in

09:57:01 the form of testimony, exhibits, documents, models and plans

09:57:04 and the like to support the application for approval of a

09:57:07 special use permit.

09:57:14 He this is your general criteria. This is your general

09:57:18 criteria at a public hearing.




09:57:19 The amount or level that a petitioner donates to the

09:57:24 community is not competent evidence.

09:57:26 It's not relevant to your decision.

09:57:31 Likewise, if the neighbor goes around to their neighbors and

09:57:37 collect signatures on a petition and presents to be you that

09:57:40 petition that says we are against it or we are for it, that,

09:57:48 too, is not competent evidence.

09:57:51 And quite frankly, their time would be better spent not

09:57:56 necessarily collecting signatures but providing competent

09:57:59 and substantial evidence at the public hearings.

09:58:04 Now, City Council has a burden.

09:58:08 The burden is on the petitioner to make this presentation.

09:58:12 But City Council, I just want to remind you, in every public

09:58:16 hearing has a burden.

09:58:17 Your burden is to take the facts as you determine them at

09:58:21 the hearing, to make findings of fact and apply them to the

09:58:24 law.

09:58:26 And when you do that, you make your findings.

09:58:28 And they need to be able to sustain legal challenges.

09:58:36 With every public hearing, obviously when somebody meets the

09:58:38 criteria, in an SU-I, what that means is there is a

09:58:43 presumption.

09:58:46 There is a presumption in the criteria. And I am going to

09:58:49 turn your attention to page 20.

09:58:53 Because here, right in front of you is the specific




09:58:56 criteria, with specific categories.

09:59:01 And as long as that criteria is met, they are issued the

09:59:05 permit.

09:59:06 Why?

09:59:06 Because there is a presumption that the criteria for

09:59:09 administrative approval is if you meet that criteria, there

09:59:13 are either no potential adverse impact or the they are

09:59:18 minimal.

09:59:19 That is your suggestions.

09:59:20 That is your presumption.

09:59:21 Now, if that's not the case, council, if that's not the case

09:59:25 based on your experience of what you hear from your

09:59:27 constituents, then one way to resolve that is to address

09:59:30 your criteria.

09:59:32 That's one way to do it.

09:59:35 Likewise, the criteria is there for applications as an SU-II

09:59:44 process under B on page 22.

09:59:48 The short answer, council, is that should council wish to go

09:59:55 back to an SU-II process it certainly can.

10:00:00 You can amend your code.

10:00:01 It is within council's purview to do it.

10:00:03 My question to you, and hopefully in this workshop you will

10:00:09 have the opportunity, is to specifically delineate what are

10:00:13 the problems?

10:00:18 Where are the problems?




10:00:18 What is the location?

10:00:20 I can tell you from my experience what I think I'm hearing

10:00:23 your constituents say and what City Council has said.

10:00:25 Issues with regard to noise, issues with regard to parking

10:00:28 and traffic, issues with regard to litter or quality of life

10:00:31 issues, public hearings -- but the question is, look at the

10:00:40 categories when you get the administrative approval and see

10:00:44 where you have the problem.

10:00:46 See where you have the problem.

10:00:48 And you have the opportunity with the tools that you are

10:00:53 given in the code of ordinances to be able to address your

10:00:55 concerns.

10:00:57 And I am prepared to answer any questions, obviously.

10:01:01 One last thing.

10:01:02 One last thing.

10:01:02 Because I have had the opportunity to discuss this with the

10:01:06 legal department and discuss this with Ms. Kert -- we are

10:01:10 willing at some point in time to come back at council's

10:01:13 pleasure to talk about quasi-judicial public hearings, and

10:01:18 the issues that have to be addressed to avoid those

10:01:21 decisions that you make being challenged and to avoid

10:01:23 litigation.

10:01:24 But that's another subject for another time.

10:01:28 But we are happy to discuss that.

10:01:30 Again I just want to thank you for the opportunity for me to




10:01:32 give you this report.

10:01:33 And I am available for any questions.

10:01:35 >>FRANK REDDICK: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

10:01:45 When this originally came about, I have to raise the

10:01:53 question about staff making add must have decisions and the

10:01:58 public has not been notified about it.

10:02:00 And I thought that was a major concern.

10:02:06 And it was my impression when I asked you to look into this

10:02:12 that the intent -- and my intent still today, not having the

10:02:22 staff make an administrative decision.

10:02:26 And you say it's not political.

10:02:29 Well, everything is political.

10:02:31 I don't care how you look at it.

10:02:32 You go buy a bar of soap this morning it's political because

10:02:36 of the price on it.

10:02:39 So I'm not going to debate.

10:02:41 That but here is what I want to know.

10:02:45 Here is what I'm looking for.

10:02:48 What disturbed me -- and I don't know how this happened.

10:02:52 I read in the paper yesterday, I believe it was, that a

10:02:55 7-Eleven is going to be on 7th Avenue, and in that paper

10:03:05 it stated you have already gone through the permit process

10:03:07 and got everything needed for the city.

10:03:11 If I had not read that in the paper, unless I'm riding

10:03:16 through Ybor City one day, I remember 7-Eleven is going to




10:03:21 be stationed there, and so good business deal.

10:03:25 But the problem is, I still believe, and still feel

10:03:29 strongly -- and I know this can be done, and I'm between

10:03:35 you, the legal department, and Ms. Coyle, I believe you can

10:03:44 come back with an ordinance that will meet these code

10:03:49 standards saying how this can be done, because the burden of

10:03:53 responsibility is not the staff, it's to the people in this

10:03:59 community.

10:04:02 And when we got them calling us and we got people stopping

10:04:08 us in the community, how did this happen?

10:04:11 They don't have no input, and we are not knowledgeable of

10:04:17 this.

10:04:18 So if that 7-Eleven already through the city, that means it

10:04:26 was done administratively.

10:04:32 And this is what I think the burden of responsibility should

10:04:34 be before this council.

10:04:37 And we should be the ones making these decisions.

10:04:39 And the public has the right to come and speak.

10:04:43 Now what went wrong?

10:04:44 >>JULIA MANDELL: City attorney.

10:04:47 This is a conversation and to get into the nuances --

10:04:55 >> Sorry.

10:04:56 >>JULIA MANDELL: Let me ask you.

10:04:59 First of all, if every single decision that the

10:05:00 administrator made on any kind of permitting came top you,




10:05:04 you would be here seven days a week, 12 hours a day.

10:05:08 >>FRANK REDDICK: My concern is alcohol.

10:05:12 I'm not concerned about land use.

10:05:15 >>JULIA MANDELL: If it's alcohol issues, then what we need

10:05:18 to do is identify what are the issues that are problematic,

10:05:25 and either revise the code to deal with those from an

10:05:29 administrative perspective and when it triggers coming to

10:05:33 council, or we deal with alcohol the way we used to deal

10:05:36 with alcohol where every alcoholic beverage approval comes

10:05:39 to council.

10:05:41 I mean, those are your options.

10:05:43 And I think that we will be talking about this a little bit

10:05:46 further also, and go through processes, but you have to

10:05:50 create -- you have two options in this realm.

10:05:53 You create provisions which clearly provide when a property

10:06:01 owner is entitled to receive their permit from staff, or you

10:06:04 create a scheme or an ordinance which has some level of

10:06:09 subjectivity to it, and that requires a review at public

10:06:13 hearing by council.

10:06:14 So it's up to you where you want to put those things.

10:06:18 That is completely within your discretion.

10:06:20 But you need to identify to the legal department and to

10:06:24 staff what those issues are so that we can draft a code that

10:06:28 meets what those needs are, and it would be very helpful for

10:06:32 us if we understood exactly what the specific issues are so




10:06:35 that when we pass the code, we are crafting one that is

10:06:39 tailored to the issues that this council --

10:06:41 >>FRANK REDDICK: My last comment is this.

10:06:43 The last comment that you made, the scheme -- and I don't

10:06:58 know about other members of council but that's what I am

10:07:00 looking for.

10:07:02 I'm looking at how this indeed worked out, and whether the

10:07:07 ordinance and scheme you use, take that responsibility from

10:07:13 staff and it comes back to this council.

10:07:15 >>JULIA MANDELL: And that is within your purview.

10:07:18 It is a legislative action which delineates which items are

10:07:21 administrative and which items come to City Council.

10:07:25 But, again, it's something that we need guidance from

10:07:28 council.

10:07:29 These decisions were made -- we have made different

10:07:32 decisions on alcohol.

10:07:33 Alcohol has always been a very difficult issue in the city

10:07:37 in terms of process.

10:07:39 We had many lawsuits over it.

10:07:41 We have gone through a variety, not with this council, with

10:07:46 other councils, different ways in which we wanted to

10:07:49 regulate alcohol, and deal with alcohol issues.

10:07:51 But it is important in order to get the type of ordinance

10:07:54 which you would wait to see for us to understand

10:07:59 specifically what the issues are that you are hearing from




10:08:02 your constituents.

10:08:03 Remember, we don't always hear those.

10:08:05 You hear those.

10:08:05 And if there's some kind of risk or some kind of

10:08:08 understanding as to what exactly those are, and then we

10:08:11 could get some consensus of council on these issues, then we

10:08:14 can craft something that meets those issues and bring that

10:08:17 back to you.

10:08:18 And that's write think, you know, it would be very much

10:08:21 valuable, especially in this workshop session, to have a

10:08:24 specific understanding and some consensus from council as to

10:08:27 what those issues are.

10:08:28 Thank you.

10:08:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have in this order, Mr. Cohen, Ms.

10:08:33 Mulhern, Mr -- Mr. Cohen, Mrs. Montelione, Ms. Mulhern, Mrs.

10:08:41 Capin.

10:08:41 >>HARRY COHEN: I would like to just start by asking sort of

10:08:44 a threshold question of Ms. Coyle.

10:08:46 This ordinance that changed this approval process that was

10:08:53 passed at the very end of the last City Council and went

10:08:57 into effect, when we all took office, it's now been in place

10:09:01 for three years.

10:09:02 >> correct.

10:09:06 >>HARRY COHEN: How many administrative approvals under the

10:09:09 scheme have there been?




10:09:13 >>CATHERINE COYLE: There have been 99.

10:09:15 And five are dry now.

10:09:18 >>HARRY COHEN: Five of which are dry now, so 94.

10:09:21 It would seem to me that one place that we might want to

10:09:25 start is to look at those approvals, look at the criteria by

10:09:29 which they were approved, and determine whether or not we

10:09:36 think that the outcome would have been different had it come

10:09:42 before council.

10:09:43 And when I say the outcome would have been different, I

10:09:46 think what I mean is, you know, whether or not individual

10:09:50 council members have gotten complaints or have gotten

10:09:56 comments from constituents about problems with these

10:10:00 particular establishments.

10:10:02 The reason I say that is because we get a lot of complaints

10:10:08 in my office about decisions that we actually made that we

10:10:10 voted on to approve alcohol in certain places, and we also

10:10:15 get a lot of complaints in my office about buildings, and

10:10:20 about PDs and different -- different land use

10:10:28 configurations that we either administratively approved or

10:10:31 approved a long time ago, not by this council.

10:10:37 I don't myself recall actually getting any complaints

10:10:40 related to an administrative approval of this type.

10:10:45 But I would be interested to see the list of the 99

10:10:49 primarily because it might help to figure out if we really

10:10:53 have a problem here, or if perhaps we don't.




10:11:02 >>CATHERINE COYLE: If I could say, in item number -- which

10:11:05 item is it?

10:11:06 Item number 5, part B, I actually do have an answer related

10:11:11 to enforcement and complaints that we have received.

10:11:15 You're right.

10:11:15 We have gone back and looked over the last three years and

10:11:18 none of the communities that we received or any of the

10:11:21 locations that TPD has been investigating either at my

10:11:26 request, the issues that they raise, and then bring to me

10:11:29 some type of enforcement from the alcohol perspective, not

10:11:32 one of them was administratively approved.

10:11:35 There are 16 of those establishments.

10:11:37 I am going to answer that part B 5.

10:11:41 I can answer it now.

10:11:42 >>HARRY COHEN: I will ask and then I am finished.

10:11:45 I am open minded about going anyway that come up wants to go

10:11:47 on this, but I would like us to base however we go on the

10:11:51 evidence of what's really happening and not make a decision

10:11:57 without actually understanding what problem it is that we

10:12:00 are trying to solve.

10:12:02 I'm fine going anyway.

10:12:04 But it seems to me there's some threshold questions that

10:12:06 have to be answered.

10:12:08 >>MARY MULHERN: Thank you.

10:12:16 Ms. Coyle, I have some questions for you.




10:12:22 First of all, I would like to add to what Councilman Cohen

10:12:26 asked for, which was a list of the administrative approvals.

10:12:30 And if we could have that at some point.

10:12:34 >> It was being refined -- I was thinking that she sent to

10:12:43 the me.

10:12:43 >> If you have that, that's great.

10:12:46 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I had her produce the same time frames,

10:12:48 your approvals and our approvals.

10:12:50 So two separate lists.

10:12:52 >>MARY MULHERN: What I would like tock see on that list is

10:12:55 whether there are special restaurants, package goods or

10:12:57 large venues, if we are going to find out --

10:13:02 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Well, none of those are large venues

10:13:04 administratively.

10:13:05 they are special restaurants.

10:13:06 They are package sales from resale establishments, not

10:13:10 on-site consumption.

10:13:11 The only on-site couples that we can approve

10:13:14 administratively is a special restaurant which closes at

10:13:16 11:00 at night Sunday through Wednesday and 1:00 at night in

10:13:19 the morning Thursday, Friday, Saturday.

10:13:23 They cut off outside amplified sound at 11 p.m.

10:13:27 The other on-site consumption we can do in association with

10:13:30 a bowling alley, with a special bowling alley license from

10:13:34 the state only that has a link to that.




10:13:41 We can do the S-class license, and a special restaurant, if

10:13:44 you want to sell liquor and we approve it, the only license

10:13:47 you can get from the state is the FRX license which is also

10:13:51 restricted at state level, 4,000 square foot.

10:13:55 >>MARY MULHERN: So we are very limited with special

10:13:59 criteria.

10:13:59 >>MARY MULHERN: But we still want to see that list.

10:14:02 Then I don't know if you have the book that Mr. Shelby gave

10:14:05 us.

10:14:07 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I do.

10:14:08 >>MARY MULHERN: If you could turn to page 15.

10:14:13 And I wasn't able to read this whole thing before the

10:14:15 meeting today.

10:14:16 But I just noticed that today -- and I want some

10:14:20 clarification on this.

10:14:24 Section 27-128, minor changes to be approved by zoning

10:14:28 administrator.

10:14:30 Substantial deviations require action by City Council.

10:14:35 When I look at B-1 -- oh, wait a minute.

10:14:44 Okay. I'm trying to understand this.

10:14:46 So any increase in intensity-- an increase intensity shall

10:14:56 include but not be limited.

10:14:57 Yes, that's what I am trying to understand.

10:14:59 And it says this for all these minor changes.

10:15:02 Increase in intensity shall include but not be limited to




10:15:06 more than 5%.

10:15:07 What does that mean?

10:15:11 >> If you have 10,000 square feet that was approved by

10:15:14 council we can guff you up to an additional 5% of floor

10:15:17 area.

10:15:19 >>MARY MULHERN: That's all you can give.

10:15:23 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Administratively for special uses and

10:15:25 site plan zoning.

10:15:27 >>MARY MULHERN: It was confusing the language.

10:15:28 So it's up to 5%.

10:15:30 Okay.

10:15:30 >> Right now distance separation is at 1,000 feet.

10:15:44 Is that correct?

10:15:46 >> It depends on where you are in the city.

10:15:48 For bars, and that's everywhere in the city.

10:15:55 Then if you are along a mixed use corridor as defined in the

10:15:58 comp plan, if you are in an urban village as defund by the

10:16:02 comp plan or if you are in an urban center as defined by the

10:16:06 comp plan it goes down to 250 feet, depending on which one

10:16:09 of those categories you are in, as shown in the comp plan,

10:16:13 250 feet, either from other alcoholic establishments or from

10:16:17 alcohol establishments and residential.

10:16:19 It just depends on the category.

10:16:20 It was based on the policies in the comp plan that drives

10:16:24 what those areas are supposed to be ultimately, whether




10:16:26 there's mixed use, how the physical pattern is in that area.

10:16:32 >>MARY MULHERN: This is just a thought that we could look

10:16:37 at the distance separation.

10:16:38 And I think it might be reasonable to have the 1,000 feet

10:16:44 for residential, not necessarily for all those other

10:16:48 categories.

10:16:49 So that might be something that we could --

10:16:54 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That was behind the point that I showed

10:16:57 you last year and Mr. Shelby showed you again, a thousand

10:17:00 feet.

10:17:01 There's behind every commercial property in the city.

10:17:05 So you will always be in a posture of having to waive that.

10:17:10 And that's the point of the do it on the map, it has always

10:17:14 been waived.

10:17:15 >>MARY MULHERN: I think that's reasonable for us to keep a

10:17:17 distance separation from other establishments, because --

10:17:23 >> And we do.

10:17:23 We have a 250-foot separation in urban villages, and that's

10:17:27 essentially what that spaces out, and the way the pattern of

10:17:29 the blocks are.

10:17:30 It's essentially one per block.

10:17:32 And that's why in a lot of them you do have a distance

10:17:35 waiver, and the ones that are coming before you.

10:17:37 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, I think a good illustration, I want

10:17:42 to see the list, and I want to see real evidence if we have




10:17:45 a problem.

10:17:46 But honestly, I think that overall in how a neighborhood

10:17:53 grows, and what kind of businesses they have, can be a

10:17:57 problem in itself.

10:17:58 You don't necessarily have to be getting a call from

10:18:02 specific bars or restaurants to say there's a problem.

10:18:07 If you know there's a proliferation of alcohol permits in

10:18:15 one neighborhood, such as in SoHo and Ybor City, you know

10:18:21 that that's something you need to look at.

10:18:24 I don't think that -- the point is, the more sales there

10:18:28 are, the more drink there is, the more adverse effect of

10:18:33 that.

10:18:33 So I think, you know, I have no question about whether

10:18:38 there's a problem or not, and especially in SoHo.

10:18:42 And I think it can happen anywhere. So it's not just about,

10:18:48 you know, dealing with specific neighborhoods.

10:18:52 Because what we see is if there's some kind of crackdown in

10:18:56 one area, it can move to another.

10:19:01 And I just have to say that -- I have one other question for

10:19:09 you.

10:19:09 Then I just want to have some other things to say.

10:19:12 When you give an administrative approval for sales, outdoor

10:19:19 cafe, does it always -- to have a permit for the business,

10:19:28 for the indoor business?

10:19:31 Can someone come to you and get a permit for the outdoor




10:19:35 cafe when they don't already have a permit for inside?

10:19:40 >> Let me clarify.

10:19:41 Are you asking about an outdoor area being added on but it's

10:19:45 on property or within a public sidewalk?

10:19:48 what are you talking about, sidewalk cafe or on property?

10:19:53 >> Outdoor sidewalk, I guess.

10:19:54 Outdoor sidewalk.

10:19:55 >> Well, there's two different things actually.

10:19:57 >> Well, both.

10:19:58 >> Okay.

10:19:59 Well, if you have an establishment that has an alcohol sales

10:20:03 permit inside today, and it could be one that was approved

10:20:07 recently or could be 68 plus years, if they want to expand

10:20:14 that area whether indoor or outdoor, you have to come back

10:20:17 in and ask for a new permit.

10:20:18 So that new permit, that's when we decide whether or not

10:20:23 those view face us.

10:20:26 No matter what the they have to meet parking, in both

10:20:30 requests, and then they have to distinguish what kind of

10:20:32 alcohol they are going to sell, beer, wine, liquor, what

10:20:36 that alcohol is associated with.

10:20:39 What comes to us at that point?

10:20:42 You said that's when you decide.

10:20:44 You decide?

10:20:49 >> So when does it come to us?




10:20:50 >> The only thing that we can approve administratively,

10:20:53 again, is a hotel, 100-plus rooms, that does not have any

10:20:59 outdoor amplified sounds, they have to get the restricted

10:21:05 license from the state.

10:21:06 And we can approve that one.

10:21:08 We can approve a bowling alley, 12-plus lanes, regulation

10:21:11 bowling alley, that qualify for the SDX lysines from the

10:21:16 state.

10:21:16 They also cannot sell in the parking lot.

10:21:18 >> Wait, wait.

10:21:19 I'm asking you specifically about sidewalk cafes.

10:21:23 You are asking about both.

10:21:25 The question you just asked me -- I'm telling you --

10:21:28 >>MARY MULHERN: I don't need to know everything that comes

10:21:30 to us.

10:21:31 I need to know about sidewalk cafes.

10:21:33 They don't come to us at all, right?

10:21:35 >> If there's an existing -- sidewalk cafes do come to you,

10:21:38 if they are outside of Ybor, Channel District and downtown.

10:21:44 The ones that are within those three areas are

10:21:46 administratively approved.

10:21:49 Or extensions.

10:21:50 >>MARY MULHERN: So they are always an extension?

10:21:54 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That's correct.

10:21:55 And you cannot sell package from the sidewalk.




10:21:57 You can only do on-site consumption.

10:22:00 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay. So if it's, say, SoHo or Seminole

10:22:05 Heights it has to come to us?

10:22:09 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That's correct.

10:22:10 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have Mrs --

10:22:12 >>MARY MULHERN: I'm not done.

10:22:13 Sorry.

10:22:15 With regard to the city attorney's request that we give

10:22:23 specific guidelines, and the idea that we have -- there

10:22:29 would be such a huge burden on council if these came to us,

10:22:35 well, they did used to come to us.

10:22:38 And I think probably a majority, maybe a majority, but

10:22:45 several of us on council did not want them to stop coming to

10:22:48 us.

10:22:49 So there was a vote, but it was close.

10:22:55 And I still feel that it's better, as Councilman Reddick was

10:22:59 saying, that we who are closest to the neighborhoods, and

10:23:05 the constituents, should be able to decide some of these

10:23:08 things.

10:23:08 So I would say that what should go back to being an S-2 --

10:23:15 it doesn't have to be everything, but I believe that

10:23:20 restaurants need to come back to us.

10:23:22 I think there's ample evidence -- and there was before we

10:23:26 changed the code -- that we had a problem, because it's hard

10:23:30 to enforce --




10:23:33 >> They do come to you.

10:23:35 Special restaurants do not.

10:23:36 And those close at a certain time during the day, they close

10:23:39 earlier and they are restricted to a certain type of license

10:23:43 type.

10:23:43 If you want to close at midnight, and not at 11:00, they

10:23:47 come to you.

10:23:47 If they want to close at 3:00, they come to you. If they

10:23:50 don't qualify for the restricted lay sense and they want to

10:23:52 sell liquor with the state, they come to you.

10:23:55 That's why you get a lot of restaurant.

10:23:56 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, I'm not sure -- you know, that's why

10:24:00 I said we need to see the list.

10:24:02 Because whether that's very enforceable or not, I don't

10:24:07 know.

10:24:07 Whether we are able to enforce the restrictions on hours of

10:24:12 operation, questionable.

10:24:15 So I think he would just need to look at the list.

10:24:21 So I would like to go back to having those come to City

10:24:24 Council.

10:24:29 Large venue.

10:24:31 And, you know, maybe package goods.

10:24:36 I mean, the reality is, because now it's easier for people

10:24:40 to get liquor licenses.

10:24:41 You are getting more requests for it.




10:24:43 It used to be if someone wanted to come and get liquor

10:24:51 license, and they had to go to council, then they might not

10:24:54 bother.

10:24:56 But if it's easier to do that you are probably getting more

10:25:00 requests.

10:25:00 That's good and bad.

10:25:01 But I think we have to care about the quality of life in all

10:25:07 of our neighborhoods and really watch that.

10:25:11 And I think maybe we do need to look at this aspiration, so

10:25:16 any input, you know, we can have on that from each other, I

10:25:21 think maybe that would help.

10:25:27 Thank you.

10:25:28 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Mrs. Montelione, Ms. Capin, Mr. Suarez.

10:25:32 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

10:25:35 I like what Mr. Shelby had said before, that this is a

10:25:38 conversation.

10:25:39 This is a workshop.

10:25:40 And it seems like it's taking the feel of an actual hearing

10:25:46 and staff report.

10:25:47 And I would like to maybe bring it back to that conversation

10:25:53 in a less formal tone.

10:25:54 A couple of things that I want to say is I don't believe

10:25:57 that when need to hear every single S-1 zoning administrator

10:26:03 decision before council.

10:26:07 I think that we certainly can make a couple of minor changes




10:26:11 to the current codes that would make what was passed in 2011

10:26:18 even better.

10:26:19 I don't think that we need to overhaul and bring everything

10:26:23 back.

10:26:24 I don't even think we need to bring some things back.

10:26:26 I think we just need to refine.

10:26:28 And that's what our codes, what we do, if we do it right, is

10:26:32 that we take what we have in the code and we make it better.

10:26:39 So with that being the premise, I also want to throw out

10:26:45 another question to council, is what direction are we going?

10:26:50 Do we want a city that attracts new residents?

10:26:53 Do we want a vibrant business climate?

10:26:55 Do he would want one that offers the amenities of a

10:26:58 metropolitan area and emerge from the past and move onto the

10:27:07 future?

10:27:08 We have just recently three chefs that were nominated for a

10:27:12 James beard ward.

10:27:16 We have a little issue at the state level with our craft

10:27:19 beer manufacturing that we spoke about to some folks

10:27:22 recently.

10:27:23 But, you know, we have developed this culture, and it

10:27:27 something that I think we can hang our hat on for these

10:27:32 small emerging entrepreneurial businesses that are making

10:27:40 this a really fun place to live, and it's attracting the

10:27:44 type of young talent that we want to attract in the city.




10:27:49 And I think that we can achieve both.

10:27:51 I mean, I think the folks who come here because of the

10:27:56 environment that he would provide and the living and the

10:28:00 quality of life, they want to have quality neighborhood.

10:28:02 I don't think it's an either-or situation that we either

10:28:05 have quality neighborhoods or we have the ability to have

10:28:09 restaurants and alcoholic beverages served during the week

10:28:15 at any type of -- time of day.

10:28:17 I don't think it's an either/or situation.

10:28:22 I think it both.

10:28:23 So the changes that I would like to offer to the current

10:28:26 code are pretty simple.

10:28:30 And having this 1,000-foot buffer rule map really puts into

10:28:37 perspective -- I mean, if we look at this map -- and as Mr.

10:28:43 Shelby said, anybody who want to deviate from the 1,000-foot

10:28:47 buffer zone and open an establishment means looking at this

10:28:51 map, pretty much any where in the city, they are going to

10:28:55 come to us.

10:28:59 If they ask for a waiver.

10:29:01 So I think that's pretty broad.

10:29:03 So we are already, I think, well positioned with the codes

10:29:08 that we have.

10:29:13 As has been often told to me, and we heard last week,

10:29:17 enforce the codes you have.

10:29:19 We don't need new ones.




10:29:21 We just need to enforce the ones we have.

10:29:22 So in order to make the ones we have just a little better,

10:29:26 section 27-127, let me see what page that is.

10:29:33 26-127 is page 4 in the book that Mr. Shelby gave to us.

10:29:41 And 27-127-B-1-A, and the third sentence says

10:29:53 recommendations from other departments or agencies may be

10:29:56 requested by the zoning administrator where necessary to

10:29:59 establish conditions or to establish compliance with the

10:30:02 conditions.

10:30:04 I think if we changed just two words in that sentence, we

10:30:09 would accomplish a lot.

10:30:11 And that would be to change "maybe" to "will be."

10:30:17 Actually changing one word.

10:30:18 Because some of the issues that brought us to where we are

10:30:21 today are issues having to do with transportation.

10:30:26 And I see Melanie Calloway here.

10:30:29 Hi, Melanie.

10:30:31 And it's often ingress or egress or dangerous situations

10:30:37 relating to how people are getting in and out of the

10:30:40 establishments that is an usual you.

10:30:43 So the other issue, I know Mr. Cohen has talked a lot about,

10:30:47 is parking.

10:30:49 That's another area where transportation may be coming in to

10:30:54 play.

10:30:54 So if the zoning administrator has to look at transportation




10:31:00 issues for these establishments, I think that gets us a

10:31:04 little closer to having -- resolve some of the problems we

10:31:08 hear.

10:31:09 With that item, B, says that the issue and determination of

10:31:15 the zoning administrator would be within 30 days of receipt.

10:31:21 If what I am suggesting requires transportation to review

10:31:25 the application, they are going to need a little more time.

10:31:28 So if we change that to 45 days, I see shaking heads -- we

10:31:34 don't have to change it, Ms. Coyle.

10:31:36 So good.

10:31:37 So they can do it within the 30 days.

10:31:39 That's fabulous.

10:31:41 And see that same section, no formal public notice or

10:31:48 hearing.

10:31:48 So a lot of times, the public doesn't benefit from -- and

10:31:55 one of the things Mr. Reddick said if you didn't read it in

10:31:59 the paper you wouldn't know that a 7-Eleven was opening in

10:32:01 Ybor City.

10:32:02 Well, there's a lot of things that happen in the city that

10:32:05 we don't know about until we read it in the paper or see it

10:32:08 on TV.

10:32:08 And those include at Christmastime when there was a home

10:32:14 invasion in my neighborhood three blocks from my house, I

10:32:17 didn't know about it until I drove to the supermarket and

10:32:19 saw media trucks outside the house and stopped saw stopped




10:32:25 an ABC news reporter to find out what was going on.

10:32:28 So I don't think that that's just applicable to the

10:32:30 alcoholic beverage situation or package sales or any of the

10:32:33 above.

10:32:34 So if we were to change the public notice, and in that

10:32:39 public notice, let everyone know what the criteria is for an

10:32:49 appeal.

10:32:51 And what the time frame is.

10:32:55 This is the establishment that is asking for a zoning

10:32:57 administrator approval for an alcoholic beverage within our

10:33:03 own criteria that we already have.

10:33:06 This is the address.

10:33:07 And this is the time frame for the zoning administrator's

10:33:15 decision so they can check back and see whether the decision

10:33:19 is going to be made, and this is the time frame that you

10:33:21 have to appeal.

10:33:22 And this is the criteria for the appeal.

10:33:24 So that neighborhoods, I think Mr. Suarez brought this up

10:33:27 awhile back, was what is the appeal process if someone

10:33:33 disagrees from a neighborhood, or anywhere else, an

10:33:37 established business owner in proximity, or anyone who has a

10:33:45 stake in that area to appeal that decision?

10:33:49 So I think that with those minor changes, I think we address

10:33:55 the problem, and we can move forward.

10:33:59 I really don't feel that we need to change the process to




10:34:03 bring these applications back to council.

10:34:05 I think we just have to take what we have and make it a

10:34:08 little bit better and move on.

10:34:10 Thank you.

10:34:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

10:34:13 I have Mrs. Capin and Mr. Suarez.

10:34:16 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

10:34:17 First of all, I was looking at the criteria and guidelines.

10:34:23 And something that came up when Mr. Shelby was standing up

10:34:26 there was that this is criteria that's applied to approve

10:34:33 administratively, which is section 27-132 on page 20.

10:34:42 And it is assumed that if you meet this criteria, there is

10:34:47 no adverse effect on the area, neighborhood, businesses,

10:34:53 nothing.

10:34:54 I want to call your attention to A-1 which is hotel 100-plus

10:35:00 rooms.

10:35:02 If you meet that criteria, you can have a rooftop bar.

10:35:10 So what I see the issue, what I thought the issue is, this

10:35:16 criteria, it's good, but what cannot be applied to this

10:35:20 criteria by the administration is the general standards.

10:35:24 It cannot apply it.

10:35:26 Administration cannot do that.

10:35:29 Correct?

10:35:29 >> Correct.

10:35:38 If.




10:35:40 >>REBECCA KERT: If they make a special criteria it can be

10:35:45 granted.

10:35:46 >>YVONNE CAPIN: When you go to general standards on page 16,

10:35:48 it's section 27-129.

10:35:52 And you go section B, number 7, control of potentially

10:35:56 adverse effects generally.

10:35:59 In addition to consideration of details, elements indicated

10:36:03 above as appropriate, to the particular class or special

10:36:07 use, under the circumstances, due consideration shall be

10:36:12 given to potentially adverse effect generally joining a

10:36:17 nearby property, the area, the neighborhood, or the city of

10:36:20 the use of occupancy as proposed.

10:36:25 That cannot be applied when it is done administratively.

10:36:31 And therein lies the issue.

10:36:33 Because if it comes to City Council, those standards can be

10:36:37 applied.

10:36:41 So I could see a future where this criteria that's in here

10:36:48 is applied by City Council, and the general standards, and

10:36:57 it comes to City Council.

10:36:58 And 99, over three years, I think City Council can handle.

10:37:02 The other thing is, and that is alcohol yuck beverage.

10:37:11 I am going to say something.

10:37:13 My husband and I were jewelers for almost 25 years.

10:37:16 When we talk about regulation, when we bought jewelry from

10:37:22 the public, had to take finger prints, had to hold the item




10:37:26 for 30 days.

10:37:27 If it was found to be stolen, you lost your money and the

10:37:32 merchandise.

10:37:35 So there's regulations in every single business that's the

10:37:42 public.

10:37:43 When we looked at the safety and health and well-being of

10:37:45 the public, that is what we are supposed to be doing here.

10:37:52 It is not -- it is not business at any cost to the public.

10:38:00 That cannot be.

10:38:02 But as a small bus person, I know what it's like to fill out

10:38:09 paperwork.

10:38:10 I did that.

10:38:10 That was my job at the jewelry business.

10:38:16 So that being said, I have to emphasize that is the issue

10:38:24 that I see administratively.

10:38:25 You cannot -- the general standards cannot be applied

10:38:28 administratively.

10:38:29 And that is the issue that we see with the public.

10:38:37 And if we can combine the two, or actually use the standards

10:38:44 that are on there, they are pretty good, with some extras to

10:38:51 apply, and then come before council for permitting.

10:38:56 I truly believe.

10:38:57 I was one of the ones that did not vote for it.

10:39:00 It was the last meeting of City Council, but it was not a

10:39:03 regular last meeting.




10:39:04 It was a special called meeting.

10:39:06 It was March 28th which was three days before the new

10:39:09 council was sworn in.

10:39:11 And specific to this item.

10:39:14 Thank you.

10:39:15 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

10:39:15 Mr. Suarez.

10:39:16 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Thank you, chair.

10:39:19 Ms. Coyle, I may have a couple questions for you so you

10:39:22 might be at the ready.

10:39:23 You know, the way I have always read the criteria for the

10:39:29 S-1 is if liquor itself is ancillary to the use, except for

10:39:36 restaurant use, meaning that for package sales, some other

10:39:40 things -- come up here.

10:39:42 I don't want to talk to you over by the door.

10:39:44 Did you need to get that phone call?

10:39:45 >> Be yes, she's trying to send them out.

10:39:48 >> If you need to, that's fine.

10:39:50 I can ask Ms. Kert then.

10:39:53 You know, it seems to me -- and I may be reading this

10:39:57 incorrectly.

10:39:59 A lot of the 99 or probably restaurants that met the

10:40:03 criteria as you set forth earlier would be my guess.

10:40:06 But in terms of the package sales, some of the package

10:40:09 sales' location, you know, things like trader Joes, as an




10:40:15 example, which is going to be selling liquor at their

10:40:18 location, or already is selling liquor at that location, I

10:40:21 assume --

10:40:22 >> I don't know if they are selling liquor.

10:40:24 They are selling beer and Wayne.

10:40:25 >> Well, beer and wine.

10:40:26 To me that's a whole on the discussion I will have with you

10:40:29 at the same time.

10:40:29 >> Well, they are two distinct things.

10:40:32 >> I know, and maybe --

10:40:34 >> At the state level, too, there's a restriction on the

10:40:36 licenses.

10:40:36 >> Exactly.

10:40:37 So that's a whole other issue.

10:40:39 What I mean is beer and wine, whatever it is they are

10:40:42 selling there at this site.

10:40:44 You know, there's a presumption that it's an ancillary sales

10:40:49 of something other than liquor, meaning that they are not a

10:40:53 liquor store, package sale, that type of thing, they are

10:40:56 selling something other than just beer and wine.

10:40:58 >> That's correct.

10:40:59 >>MIKE SUAREZ: And same thing with a restaurant.

10:41:02 The implication is that liquor is a part of their sales when

10:41:07 they are looking at a menu and somebody wants to buy a glass

10:41:10 of wine or bottle of wine, or something like that.




10:41:13 It's not we are here to drink only and not going to have a

10:41:16 meal.

10:41:16 And I think that sometimes we lose sight of what it is that

10:41:20 we are trying to do with the S-1.

10:41:22 At least in my mind.

10:41:23 I think that we goat -- we have layered things on top of

10:41:27 things on top of things that have complicated and made the

10:41:31 system much more convoluted than it needs to be.

10:41:34 Now, how we undo the ball of yarn that has been created is

10:41:40 really the difficulty, because as Ms. Capin just mentioned

10:41:46 about the general standards, sometimes, you know, when we

10:41:48 are talking about the health, safety, other things that are

10:41:51 part of it, we can't even use that in our decisions when we

10:41:56 are doing land use decisions, you know, meaning let's say a

10:42:01 police officer comes in, says we just raided a place, we

10:42:04 can't go back and say something about it.

10:42:06 I mean, little things like that which to me are much more

10:42:09 egregious than any of the administrative decisions that are

10:42:12 made, meaning our controls over potentially bad actors out

10:42:17 there are restricted by our own rules, and some of the state

10:42:23 rules, so when we are looking at a quasi-judicial land use

10:42:26 hearing, we are stuck.

10:42:27 We are stuck by what we have already put in the

10:42:29 comprehensive plan.

10:42:30 We are stuck by what we already have in our code.




10:42:35 So we are really in a weird position.

10:42:40 Former councils well before any of us ever served -- I

10:42:45 shouldn't say that, necessarily -- and, you know, over the

10:42:48 years have become classified into rules that we can do it

10:42:54 when it really doesn't have any more meaning to be used.

10:42:58 So my question to you is, I think Mrs. Capin mentioned about

10:43:02 the general standards as part of the S-1 application

10:43:04 process, is that a possibility that we could use some of

10:43:07 those criteria in addition to the criteria that's already

10:43:10 set forth?

10:43:14 >>CATHERINE COYLE: We don't directly apply the standard in

10:43:16 an S-1 because it is legislatively predetermined by you in

10:43:20 your act to adopt the S-1 criteria, the that that's already

10:43:25 met.

10:43:26 And that's why we only follow the 1st-1 criteria because

10:43:30 you made that decision to make it an S-1.

10:43:33 >> So you are saying by presumption it's already been met?

10:43:37 >> That's correct.

10:43:37 >> So once those general standards are met -- and I think

10:43:41 that there are some things in here that may or may not be

10:43:45 met, we just don't know about it because it's

10:43:47 administratively done, you know, that criteria --

10:43:50 >> Well, you do know about it when you set the criteria.

10:43:53 >>MIKE SUAREZ: Exactly.

10:43:55 Well, my point is on a case-by-case basis the argument is




10:43:58 always going to be we didn't know about it, we as a council,

10:44:01 we as a public, didn't know about this decision, and we

10:44:03 think that you have misapplied what is either general

10:44:07 standards or something that we don't like, meaning that the

10:44:09 neighborhood or anything else.

10:44:11 I mean, we see that all the time.

10:44:13 Administrative decisions, because they are not in the public

10:44:15 eye, generally, it makes it a little more a difficult

10:44:20 process for a neighborhood to say, why has this been zoned

10:44:25 as is when another neighborhood location had to come to

10:44:30 council, you know?

10:44:31 And of course there's lots of different distinctions as to

10:44:34 why that is.

10:44:35 So we have a real problem with how that looks to the public.

10:44:39 Our problem is more of a public perception problem than it

10:44:42 is a necessary land use problem.

10:44:45 But I do think land use is a problem in terms of the way

10:44:48 that we have essentially put this jigsaw puzzle together,

10:44:53 you know.

10:44:53 What we have done is we sawed off certain parts and we have

10:44:56 added other things.

10:44:57 And what used to be a puzzle that looked good now looks sort

10:45:01 of like lots of different visions.

10:45:05 And it doesn't really fit so much.

10:45:08 I don't think we are going to come to a decision in this




10:45:10 workshop, or maybe even in the course of time that we

10:45:13 continue to serve on council together to solve all those

10:45:17 problems, and I mentioned this to Mr. Snelling yesterday,

10:45:24 when you have lapped use rights and business issues on top

10:45:28 of that which become land use, which I think is the wrong

10:45:31 way to approach it -- I have told you this many times,

10:45:33 too -- we get into a situation where all business use

10:45:36 becomes a land use by virtue of the way the process is set

10:45:39 up now.

10:45:40 Okay?

10:45:41 We have discussed in certain circumstances where we can have

10:45:44 a business use for certain things.

10:45:46 You and I have had some discussion as to why is parking or

10:45:51 liquor sales part of the a land use process as opposed to

10:45:54 removing that and making it a business use?

10:45:57 I don't think there's any state law that preempts us from

10:46:01 doing that.

10:46:01 >> On the alcohol side.

10:46:02 >> On the alcohol side, but only in relation to --

10:46:05 >>CATHERINE COYLE: We don't control the actors.

10:46:07 >>MIKE SUAREZ: No, but again only in relation to their

10:46:10 ability to sell liquor.

10:46:11 The land use itself is attached to that, though, when we do

10:46:15 a land use hearing.

10:46:16 Am I correct?




10:46:19 >>CATHERINE COYLE: The decisions that are made, we tell that

10:46:21 property owner that from this location, this type of use can

10:46:24 be done.

10:46:27 That alcohol can be sold.

10:46:29 >> Ms. Coyle, that's my point.

10:46:31 We have no control over who gets a permit.

10:46:33 We only have control over how they use that particular land

10:46:37 that is selling beer, wine, liquor.

10:46:40 >> And it's a fine line.

10:46:42 >>MIKE SUAREZ: It's a fine line.

10:46:43 And again there's in a reason, and there's no preemption on

10:46:46 the state's side that say we want liquor to be a business

10:46:51 use and make a process to be separate from land use.

10:46:53 >> We cannot control the actor.

10:46:55 >>MIKE SUAREZ: You are misunderstanding the point, Ms.

10:47:01 Coyle.

10:47:01 The point is not that we are going to control the actor.

10:47:04 He is going to have a business, and we could put a business

10:47:07 use permit for that particular business.

10:47:10 >> Not specifically for alcohol sales, but yes, like a

10:47:13 restaurant, a class of restaurants --

10:47:16 >> There's a lot that we can control that has nothing to do

10:47:18 with the ability to sell liquor.

10:47:20 But we can control his ability to operate.

10:47:23 >> That's correct.




10:47:24 >>MIKE SUAREZ: That's different.

10:47:26 Don't get too confused in this.

10:47:29 I don't want to confuse you any more than you confused

10:47:32 yourself.

10:47:32 >> No, you were going with the liquor thing.

10:47:35 That's what I thought.

10:47:35 >> Sometimes we get too much into the weeds and don't look

10:47:38 at the big picture.

10:47:40 The big picture is the special use and the S-1 I look at as

10:47:45 something that's ancillary to, whatever the land use is or

10:47:47 the business operation is.

10:47:49 Meaning, you know, gross are you stores, convenience stores,

10:47:52 things like that where they are selling other things than

10:47:54 just liquor.

10:47:55 That's not what their purpose S.nightclubs have a different

10:47:57 purpose.

10:47:58 A lot of times the only thing they are selling besides

10:48:01 entrance to their venue is liquor.

10:48:03 Okay?

10:48:04 You know, same thing with certain on the types of things.

10:48:06 It's funny that you still have bowling -- alleys in here.

10:48:12 Bowling alleys are sort of a dinosaur that don't exist in a

10:48:15 large way anymore and yet we still have them in their code.

10:48:18 >> We have a few in the city.

10:48:19 >> Again, it's a situation where, you know, bowling alleys




10:48:24 probably used to proliferate quite a bit over the course of

10:48:27 time within city limits, and they are no longer there.

10:48:30 The question I have for you -- and this is something that I

10:48:33 think we need to talk more about.

10:48:35 In fact, how do we separate those things?

10:48:40 Because the communities of the neighbors have more to do

10:48:43 with the use of the land, and not just, you know, the way

10:48:50 this issue versus land use.

10:48:52 You know, you might like a restaurant there but if they are

10:48:54 not using it as a restaurant but using it as a bar, it makes

10:48:58 it a little problem.

10:48:59 We try to solve that problem with be the way we audit their

10:49:02 numbers in whether or not they are selling more foods than

10:49:05 they are selling liquor.

10:49:06 There's simple things that we try and do.

10:49:08 And I don't know if we have to throw out the baby with the

10:49:11 bath water but I agree with Mrs. Montelione that we probably

10:49:14 need to tweak some things.

10:49:15 I'm not sure we are going to be doing that today.

10:49:17 But I do think we need to tweet some things so when we look

10:49:20 at administrative decisions that are done on the S-1, that

10:49:24 we have clear lines, that we can report directly to the

10:49:27 public to say what they are, and in addition, what the

10:49:31 appeal process is, if there is something that they believe

10:49:35 is not going to fit well within their neighborhood.




10:49:38 I think that's part of the process and something we are

10:49:40 going to need to discuss in the future.

10:49:42 Thank you.

10:49:43 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

10:49:45 Let me just say this.

10:49:46 This is really has a lot to do with the way people think.

10:49:51 It used to be if you had a gas station, and you wanted

10:49:55 alcohol, whoa, whoa that was taboo.

10:49:58 They didn't want you driving and drinking.

10:50:01 Now all the gas station versus alcohol.

10:50:05 It used to be that alcohol was restricted to hotels,

10:50:09 restaurants, and package stores.

10:50:13 Then you have the special uses.

10:50:15 You had a wood shop. You went to a barbershop, beer.

10:50:22 You went to a clothing store, try it on, a little drink

10:50:26 before we try on this suit or dress.

10:50:28 So, I mean, that's how it got.

10:50:31 I'm telling you the facts and you know it and I know it.

10:50:34 We just don't say it.

10:50:35 Well, I'm telling you what happened.

10:50:38 However, we haven't asked much of the police department.

10:50:41 When you stop and think and realize what's happening, I

10:50:46 don't believe -- and I'm not thinking about anyone here

10:50:49 specifically.

10:50:49 I love you all.




10:50:50 I'm not thinking about the other council members that I

10:50:53 worked with in the past.

10:50:54 Those that are still living.

10:50:56 And all of these things that happened with different

10:50:59 administrations.

10:51:00 I would venture to be say that one half of 100% different

10:51:07 between what they gave you administratively, you would have

10:51:09 gotten from this council, or any other council that was

10:51:12 here.

10:51:13 So I have no fault with that.

10:51:16 What I am trying to say is, we have no fix for the problem

10:51:19 because we have never identified the problem.

10:51:24 So let's put things in perspective.

10:51:26 Let work with the police department.

10:51:27 Let's set a set of rules of violation A, B, C and D, class

10:51:33 1, you did something terribly wrong.

10:51:37 Class 2, class 3, class 4.

10:51:40 That day you thought you weren't going to have to have TPD

10:51:44 in your establishment and you didn't have enough police

10:51:47 officers on duty.

10:51:48 There's a fine for that.

10:51:49 And if it goes up, the violation gets more and more

10:51:51 critical.

10:51:52 And you have a one, two and three categories, for the first

10:51:57 time 500 if possible.




10:51:59 I don't know, I'm just throwing out ideas.

10:52:01 The second one a thousand.

10:52:02 And the third one is 1500 and ten days closure.

10:52:06 Something like that.

10:52:07 I'm just talking.

10:52:08 So that you can understand and the people that have these

10:52:12 licenses also realize and understand what's going to happen

10:52:16 if they do that.

10:52:18 I would venture to say that if someone walked in here with

10:52:23 medical marijuana before it's approved in their pocket, what

10:52:27 are we going to do, close out City Hall?

10:52:31 We didn't do it.

10:52:33 We didn't sell it.

10:52:34 But yet we are applying the same principle to someone else.

10:52:38 Yes, if they are selling it in that liquor store or in that

10:52:42 restaurant, and I think that's a penalty 1.

10:52:46 If they are storing it and selling it and doing it, the

10:52:48 police department can do this.

10:52:51 And they have a guideline of what to do.

10:52:54 No one has said anything.

10:52:55 I look at the code of ordinances, I'm looking at them, and

10:53:00 they are that thick.

10:53:01 I look at just this little page that Mr. Shelby took some

10:53:04 time to put it together.

10:53:07 Thanks, Mr. Shelby.




10:53:08 You got ten different types of alcohol zonings and visions

10:53:13 and what to do.

10:53:13 It's not that simple.

10:53:14 So when you look at these things, narrow down the issues.

10:53:21 What administrative complaints have we received from the

10:53:23 public, or have they received?

10:53:25 What are we doing about those issues?

10:53:28 What is this hearing about?

10:53:31 What is the future of alcoholic hearings going to be?

10:53:35 How can we tweak and direct the administration to do what is

10:53:38 best for the general public?

10:53:41 Then look at these approvals and see how we can solve these

10:53:44 problems.

10:53:47 When these things come -- and by the way, there's three

10:53:50 individuals that were here.

10:53:51 One left, Mr. Mechanic, Mr. Gardner, Mr. Michelini -- they

10:53:56 also testified way back when they said the administrative

10:53:59 process is the best way to go because it saves the public

10:54:02 money in applying time, and they make a living, or part of a

10:54:07 living doing this.

10:54:10 Have to say thank you to the three gentlemen for taking a

10:54:13 pay cut and doing things that are right for your customers.

10:54:16 And when you look at these things, how do we meet these

10:54:19 challenges?

10:54:20 And how do you address these challenges?




10:54:23 I think that this council has -- who is the chairman or

10:54:30 chairperson of this committee?

10:54:32 Of this council?

10:54:35 Is it public works?

10:54:36 Is it finance? Is it -- tell me.

10:54:41 Very hard.

10:54:43 Very hard to say who the chairperson would be when it comes

10:54:46 to alcoholic beverages and zoning.

10:54:50 Appoint someone to work with the police department, come

10:54:52 back with a report, meet with the general consensus of the

10:54:55 public, come back with a diagram of issues, and how to solve

10:55:01 these issues.

10:55:01 We can talk on this forever.

10:55:03 And get very little done.

10:55:05 That's my opinion.

10:55:07 Than or we can go and meet with the police department, meet

10:55:10 with the chief.

10:55:11 They are the ones that are doing the enforcement, and work

10:55:15 out a sensible solution that will solve most of these

10:55:19 problems.

10:55:20 You are always going to have problems in life because we are

10:55:22 humans.

10:55:23 I don't care what regulations you have.

10:55:25 Someone is going to violate it.

10:55:30 And we have to get together and come to some consensus of




10:55:35 these issues so that the public is well informed, number

10:55:38 one, be informed.

10:55:42 Both the general public and the owners of these

10:55:45 establishments.

10:55:47 Know what you are facing so they won't say, oh, I didn't

10:55:50 know that.

10:55:51 That's not acceptable anymore.

10:55:56 It has a process of those violations, so much that you have

10:56:00 to pay it within ten days.

10:56:01 If you don't pay it within ten days the feign doubles, you

10:56:04 go to court.

10:56:05 Whatever it is, if under the circumstances legally possible.

10:56:07 I just want this council to resolve these matters, and let's

10:56:13 get forward.

10:56:15 The issue of this city -- let me tell you something.

10:56:17 We better thinking not only of alcohol, but in the next 20

10:56:20 years you better start thinking of at least 50,000 people

10:56:23 moving to this city.

10:56:24 You better be prepared, because they ain't going to wait.

10:56:29 And once they are here you better have the adequate water,

10:56:33 sewer, roads, availability of housing, and other things,

10:56:40 public enforcement of the laws.

10:56:42 So I think that -- I see cannot McDonald there.

10:56:50 I am not going to go any further.

10:56:51 He knows and I know what this city and these council members




10:56:54 know what we need.

10:57:00 And I firmly believe that by setting the criteria of

10:57:03 different class 1, class 2, class 3 violations, that if you

10:57:08 follow those categories, the first one, the second one, and

10:57:12 that same category, and you go to the next violation, it

10:57:14 gets a little harder until you are closed.

10:57:17 And the public is protected, and we are protected.

10:57:20 But I don't even know if that's legally possible because I

10:57:23 never talked to this legal department about it.

10:57:25 So what I am saying is, let get together, the police

10:57:29 department, the legal department, and let's work this thing

10:57:33 out, and we can have a consensus to be brought up to the

10:57:36 public in a general conversation like we are having today.

10:57:39 I want to thank you all.

10:57:40 You have been waiting here very patiently for almost two

10:57:42 hours and haven't even spoken yet.

10:57:45 So what I am saying is, I think it can be resolved.

10:57:49 It just needs to be tweaked.

10:57:51 And let's find out what the problems are, and let's solve

10:57:54 them.

10:57:55 If throws a bad egg we'll get rid of them.

10:57:58 All right.

10:57:58 Any other council members on this?

10:58:00 If not we'll go to the other subject matter.

10:58:02 Mr. Cohen.




10:58:03 >>HARRY COHEN: Well, thank you, Mr. Chair.

10:58:06 I just want to come back to where we started, and just try

10:58:11 to -- only for the moment with the issue of the S-II and

10:58:18 S-I, because clearly when we listen to each other talk, all

10:58:23 sorts of issues related to alcohol that council members have

10:58:26 concerns about.

10:58:26 So I am going to just con fine myself to the moment to the

10:58:30 S-1, S-2 discussion.

10:58:33 I think that each of us, if we scrutinize the list of the 99

10:58:38 approval itself, and we think of what councilwoman Capin

10:58:41 said about the subject interest rather than the objectivity

10:58:45 of the analysis, under the circumstances really our staff

10:58:50 that did do this analysis.

10:58:52 If each one of us individually, looking at the approvals

10:58:55 that have been granted in the last three years, based on our

10:58:59 own knowledge of the neighborhood that are affected, and

10:59:06 should any of this have gone differently had a subjective

10:59:11 standard been applied?

10:59:12 And I think are if we all came back together having looked

10:59:15 at that list, we would probably pretty easily, it would

10:59:19 bounce out to us, it would reveal itself to us what are the

10:59:22 things that might need to be with tweaked?

10:59:25 Councilwoman Mulhern mentioned some of the neighborhoods

10:59:28 where there are problems.

10:59:30 There's no question that there are problems.




10:59:33 Is the S-1, S-2 process change that took place three years

10:59:37 ago the cause of those problems, or is it something else?

10:59:41 That's what I would like to know.

10:59:44 No question we have problems we have to solve.

10:59:47 Is that piece of it, though, going to be relevant to solving

10:59:50 it?

10:59:50 I think that what I learned from everybody today in the

10:59:53 course of this discussion is that a package sale, stores

10:59:59 that are administratively approved, probably has some

11:00:03 subjective criteria that need to be looked at, not just

11:00:12 subject you've criteria, meaning the effect on the

11:00:15 surrounding neighborhood.

11:00:16 We need to go through the list and actually see like the

11:00:19 7-Eleven example that Councilman Reddick made, see where

11:00:22 those have taken place, and if in our individual opinions

11:00:26 the decision would have been different.

11:00:29 If it would have been, then I think we have something to

11:00:31 come together and talk about in terms of tweaking the

11:00:36 ordinance.

11:00:37 But I think without that analysis, it's impossible to really

11:00:41 move forward and figure out.

11:00:43 We may not need to change things as it applies to bowling

11:00:46 alleys but we may want to change it as applies to package

11:00:50 stores.

11:00:50 Only the analysis is going to tell us that.




11:00:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: See what you started, Mr. Cohen?

11:00:58 Mrs. Montelione, Mrs. Mulhern.

11:00:59 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I was going to ask if we have that list

11:01:04 and then look at the list before we conclude the discussion.

11:01:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I would like to get to the public.

11:01:15 But I also understand the council wants a second round.

11:01:18 You have a second round.

11:01:19 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Okay.

11:01:24 So here is the list as I understand it from Ms. Coyle.

11:01:28 These are the 99.

11:01:31 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Since April 1st, 2011, the SU map --

11:01:45 >> Does this map correspond with what you just gave us?

11:01:49 >> The map is on the back.

11:01:50 The table first.

11:01:54 These are the administrative approvals since April 1st,

11:01:57 the 2011 when the ordinance went into effect.

11:02:00 And you will see the X'es show what's dry, and just the

11:02:05 coloration for what the uses are that are approved.

11:02:13 I haven't proofed of this all the way.

11:02:16 So this is my first glance at it too but this shows how they

11:02:19 are scat ordinary throughout the city.

11:02:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Excuse me, we are discussing something

11:02:24 that we have never seen?

11:02:27 >>CATHERINE COYLE: Yes.

11:02:28 No, I mean it comes straight from the database.




11:02:31 Yes, it is correct.

11:02:34 And then the S-2 map which is still printing is this one.

11:02:40 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I am really more concerned with the S-1

11:02:45 map, Mrs. Coyle.

11:02:46 So glancing over this, just picking out a few, we have

11:02:58 Carney, chop house, Beef O'Brady's, we have -- I thought

11:03:03 this was a workshop that we use times to discuss things in a

11:03:09 subject matter.

11:03:09 >> We discussed this at the beginning of the workshop.

11:03:13 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Well, from Mr. Shelby several days ago,

11:03:18 I read through the book.

11:03:19 Some folks did, some folks didn't so I don't think it

11:03:22 matters.

11:03:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Keep this a discussion between the can

11:03:24 council and participants in the audience.

11:03:30 >>CATHY COYLE: This is --

11:03:31 >>LISA MONTELIONE: You can produce something that quick, so

11:03:34 technology is working.

11:03:35 >> I don't want to cause confusion.

11:03:38 I am simply giving it because you mentioned it.

11:03:40 So it's up to you.

11:03:41 You can just absorb it.

11:03:43 >>LISA MONTELIONE: And this is a testament to the

11:03:47 improvement of our technology.

11:03:48 So thank you for that, because it used to be able if we




11:03:52 wanted something like this, it probably would have taken us

11:03:55 months to produce something like this, and you did it in

11:03:57 minutes.

11:03:58 So we are moving into the future.

11:04:01 So, anyway, looking at these, you know, several of us have

11:04:05 touched on the fact that it's not necessarily the type of

11:04:11 business.

11:04:11 I mean, we have got Nordstroms -- I mean, taco bus downtown.

11:04:21 It's often subjective criteria that what's being complained

11:04:27 about by neighborhoods.

11:04:29 and it's that subjective criteria that Mr. Shelby pointed

11:04:32 out earlier that may or may not be substantial and competent

11:04:36 evidence, because in somebody's opinion, because they don't

11:04:40 like a particular type of establishment, doesn't mean that

11:04:44 we can deny that particular type of establishment.

11:04:46 They have just as much a right to exist as any other type of

11:04:50 establishment.

11:04:52 Just because somebody doesn't like it doesn't mean that, you

11:04:54 know, we have the right to deny that you are being in

11:04:59 business.

11:04:59 And I don't think that as Mr. Suarez said we should throw

11:05:06 out the baby with the bath water.

11:05:07 I don't think that there are times where any of these would

11:05:16 have come to us where we could have had any more or any

11:05:22 different discussion than the zoning administrator looks at




11:05:26 when she takes the applications in.

11:05:28 I mean, what we are basically saying is that we have no

11:05:32 trust in our zoning administrator to do the right thing

11:05:37 according to the criteria that we set as a council.

11:05:40 And I think if we set the criteria and give the outline, and

11:05:47 as Mr. Suarez said, make it very clear, and have very clear

11:05:52 lines, that we should trust the professionals to do the

11:05:56 right thing.

11:05:57 So I think it's incumbent upon us, as Mr. Miranda pointed

11:06:06 out, to save the public money, to create a city that is

11:06:13 welcoming and friendly to businesses, and to create a

11:06:18 atmosphere where people want to live because they can trust

11:06:20 that not only their council is doing the right thing but the

11:06:24 staff that is hired and working for the city is doing the

11:06:29 right thing.

11:06:30 And I believe everybody wants to hear from the public.

11:06:36 So that's what I have for now.

11:06:38 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

11:06:39 Anyone else before I go to the public?

11:06:40 Mrs. Mulhern?

11:06:41 >>MARY MULHERN: Yes.

11:06:42 I just wanted to ask that we get in addition to this any

11:06:49 minor changes that have been approved in the last three

11:06:55 years, a list of those.

11:07:00 The alcoholic beverage permits.




11:07:07 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.

11:07:07 Who are you asking?

11:07:08 >>MARY MULHERN: Ms. Coyle, I guess.

11:07:18 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Technology made her disappear.

11:07:23 Public?

11:07:27 >>STEVE MICHELINI: There's a couple things that I would

11:07:30 like to bring to council's attention.

11:07:31 The first is continuity.

11:07:33 You know, the public relies on continuity and stability

11:07:37 regarding the process of alcohol.

11:07:40 Because what happens is that the businesses borrow money.

11:07:44 They go to banks.

11:07:46 Financial institutions process loans.

11:07:48 These take time.

11:07:50 And in the process of that, establishments hire employees.

11:07:55 They buy products from purveyors.

11:08:00 And when you have projects, talking about new projects, as

11:08:03 well as "stand your ground" and bars that borrow money, they

11:08:07 can't get those loans because no one is sure what's

11:08:10 happening with that you are zoning.

11:08:13 These issues regarding alcohol and their effect on the

11:08:17 businesses, the businesses value.

11:08:20 They carry those values on their books.

11:08:22 They borrow against them.

11:08:24 Be you know, we go on and we recruit events to come to




11:08:28 Tampa, whether they are cultural events or sporting events,

11:08:31 and then we tell people that when they are over that you

11:08:34 have nothing to do, because you have shut down the

11:08:36 entertainment complexes due to the hours and restrictions,

11:08:41 the ability to have outside music, the ability to the

11:08:49 entertain anyone, so now where do they go?

11:08:52 They are restricted to Ybor City or restricted to the inside

11:08:54 of the hotel.

11:08:55 And as council has discussed, what are the objectives here?

11:08:59 And what do you really want us to address?

11:09:02 Because if you can articulate what the issue is, we as an

11:09:06 industry and the people that I represent can come back to

11:09:08 you with effective measures to control them.

11:09:12 We need a degree of reliability so that when you grant an

11:09:17 approval, you can take that approval and operate it within

11:09:19 an establishment effectively.

11:09:23 The state has jurisdiction over many of these issues.

11:09:27 Mr. Capitano was here earlier and he's already told you

11:09:30 before the state has offered to provide you with additional

11:09:32 tools, if you need them.

11:09:34 You simply have to identify what they are.

11:09:37 They already have the power to revoke.

11:09:40 They have the power to suspend.

11:09:41 And that's immediate.

11:09:43 That's not 30 days.




11:09:45 When we have the criteria regarding land use regulations or

11:09:48 alcohol regulations, and they are established, you either

11:09:54 meet the criteria or you don't.

11:09:55 If you don't, it's a public hearing.

11:09:57 If you meet the criteria, there's an abbreviated process.

11:10:01 And as I spoke before, supporting that, and as you know,

11:10:06 that does speed things up.

11:10:08 It cost itself less money.

11:10:10 When you affect the zoning, these go throughout the

11:10:16 community.

11:10:16 They affect whether or not you can get a business

11:10:18 established.

11:10:19 And just in the last week, we have had establishments that

11:10:21 could no longer get their loans for their businesses,

11:10:24 because of this continuing discussion regarding alcohol and

11:10:28 what the process is.

11:10:31 The effects are not just immediate and local.

11:10:34 They are regional.

11:10:35 Other cities that we are competing with for businesses take

11:10:38 these articles -- if I can have 30 more second, council.

11:10:44 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: 30.

11:10:44 Let's go.

11:10:45 >> They take these articles that are showing up in the

11:10:48 newspapers, and when we go to Charlotte and when we go to

11:10:51 Austin and we go to these other communities, try to recruit




11:10:54 businesses, they take it and shove it in our face.

11:10:57 So the ability to recruit new business is dramatically

11:11:02 affected.

11:11:03 And we have to establish and determine what we are going to

11:11:05 be and how we are going to get there.

11:11:07 I'm certainly willing to work with the council and work with

11:11:10 TPD and staff to come up with some reasonable regulations.

11:11:14 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:11:17 To move from Charlotte to Tampa and from Tampa to Charlotte.

11:11:21 Next.

11:11:21 >> Good morning.

11:11:27 Viktor DiMaio, independent parkway, suite 195.

11:11:31 I'm here today to speak on this issue because I had two

11:11:37 examples that came before City Council, and I am going to

11:11:40 tell you what you need, because the experiences in the S-2

11:11:44 process and tell you what you didn't nobody because of the

11:11:46 S-1 problem sees.

11:11:48 My personal feeling is, the S-1 versus S-2 process is

11:11:51 broken.

11:11:52 It's a mess.

11:11:52 Every time I went to figure out whether I am going to go

11:11:57 with S-1, S-2, it took a Ouija board and light a candle in

11:12:03 church.

11:12:03 And I'll give you a an example.

11:12:06 Bern's, which you granted full liquor, we had to go through




11:12:09 the S-1 process to get beer and wine which cost them $900

11:12:13 and then we had to go through the S-2 to get liquor which

11:12:16 cost them $2,000.

11:12:18 So Bern's had to pay twice, once for the S-1 and secondly

11:12:22 $2,000 in addition for the S-2.

11:12:24 Now the Outpost restaurant on Kennedy, at the same exact

11:12:28 time, I went through not one, not two, but three knock down

11:12:31 drag-out hearings before City Council, okay, and we had to

11:12:33 pay $2,000.

11:12:35 A block away to the east of us, going through the S-1

11:12:41 process.

11:12:42 I was told when I went through the Outpost, living 250 feet

11:12:47 and you are 150 feet away from another restaurant, I said,

11:12:51 okay, that's fine.

11:12:52 You are 175 feet away from another restaurant.

11:12:54 Another resident, that's fine.

11:12:59 We can't street parking.

11:13:00 That can't count towards your parking.

11:13:02 And your lease has to be five years.

11:13:05 Every one of those things I mentioned on the Outpost was

11:13:10 chosen because it shares a wall with Nissan plaza.

11:13:17 And it shares another wall with a ten story residence of

11:13:22 students, and what's the requirement there?

11:13:24 Zero.

11:13:26 On the parking, they counted all the street parking on




11:13:29 central.

11:13:30 Nowhere in the code did it say that the parking on central

11:13:33 can be counted.

11:13:34 It just something that's made up because it's an historical

11:13:37 building.

11:13:38 I know that the Cuban Italian, I get a little excited at

11:13:44 times.

11:13:51 My mom was Cuban and dad Italian so I'm 50-50.

11:13:57 >> You can't imagine the discussion Cathy Coyle and I had

11:14:01 over this one issue.

11:14:02 >> And why the change got away from the S-1 process and only

11:14:06 pay $900 and no public hearing, and why my clients had to go

11:14:10 through three public hearings and get beat to a pulp when

11:14:14 they are right across from Tampa U as well.

11:14:17 So it's not fair.

11:14:19 Everybody plays by the same level field and I agree with the

11:14:23 council, 99% of these things if they went to council would

11:14:26 probably be approved anyway.

11:14:27 The only way to make this fair in my opinion is to have them

11:14:30 all come before City Council and not have to go through this

11:14:33 arbitrary rulemaking process that the administration does.

11:14:38 (Bell sounds).

11:14:44 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Three months.

11:14:44 >> Well, a long time through the S-2 process which is why we

11:14:47 had to go through the S-1 for Bern's.




11:14:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Let me say this.

11:14:51 I'm not speaking to you, sir.

11:14:55 But I find it hard to believe that Cathy Coyle or anyone

11:15:00 there would do something that is not within the direction of

11:15:04 the code.

11:15:06 And that's all I am going to say, period.

11:15:09 Thank you very much.

11:15:11 Next.

11:15:11 >> 1304 west Jetton Avenue, here partly on my own behalf,

11:15:21 partly on behalf of Historic Hyde Park neighborhood

11:15:25 association.

11:15:25 I'll discuss with the association's point first.

11:15:27 And that has to be do with the parking requirements, the

11:15:33 alternative design standards for parking.

11:15:40 There's been some discussion about a registration for these

11:15:43 leases so they can't be tracked.

11:15:48 In a letter, there is no registration process.

11:15:55 We think that there should be, that it should be much more

11:16:02 specific than some generic concept of the valet companies

11:16:09 having all the spaces that are deficient for their

11:16:15 customers, rather it should be specific between the

11:16:18 business, the restaurant, bar, whatever it may be, and the

11:16:24 property owner.

11:16:25 Not the tenant of the property.

11:16:27 The property owner.




11:16:28 Because if the tenant goes away, so does the lease.

11:16:38 The lease should be specific to sites.

11:16:40 There's no reason why ultimately when somebody is going to

11:16:44 ask for the leases on a particular set of spaces, that those

11:16:50 can't be found by staff.

11:16:55 It could be a little bit of work until everything gets put

11:16:58 back.

11:16:59 But all the recommendations are shown on-site.

11:17:02 So if a lease is going to be made for these five spaces, and

11:17:07 identified, put into a registry, the leases should be for

11:17:10 five years if we discussed long enough, and the official

11:17:18 records of Hillsborough County.

11:17:20 That way, they give people notice, they are going to run

11:17:27 with the land, unless somebody comes back and says they have

11:17:30 been canceled.

11:17:32 So I think it provides a way to enforce that.

11:17:39 I'll do what I call the one test theory.

11:17:41 So when there's a problem, find out exactly how you are

11:17:46 going to fix it.

11:17:47 (Bell sounds)

11:17:48 So that's our most important objection because that's the

11:17:55 standard problem we run into with these kind of things.

11:17:58 Real quickly on the S-1, S-2, I think the conversation today

11:18:03 has been on point.

11:18:05 One suggestion, to separate the business regulation from a




11:18:09 land use.

11:18:11 I think that's a great idea.

11:18:13 We'll want to see it brought back before City Council.

11:18:16 But the appeal process, I think some of these other things

11:18:19 can be addressed if in fact there is notice that goes out

11:18:23 and gives public notice that they have the right to appeal

11:18:26 that you are not going to give up the general standards from

11:18:28 that point.

11:18:29 >>> Good morning.

11:18:35 Ellen Snelling, alcohol coalition.

11:18:38 As far as the S-1 and S-2 I know I was part of the workshop

11:18:41 to consider how this separates out that type of thing and

11:18:45 administrative for some of the simple ones that really are

11:18:48 not primarily selling alcohol.

11:18:50 They are doing other things.

11:18:51 So as far as I can tell, as far as way heard in the

11:18:55 community, I don't see a problem with the way it is right

11:18:57 now.

11:18:57 Just in general, I would like to say that Hillsborough

11:19:01 County is number one or number two in DUI arrests in alcohol

11:19:06 related crashes, injuries, fatality, been that way for a

11:19:09 long time.

11:19:09 So what we see as a community coalition is the effect that

11:19:12 alcohol on the entire community.

11:19:14 And as far as the city goes, I know that I have heard the




11:19:18 last thing, there's over a thousand total alcohol permits

11:19:22 and licenses.

11:19:23 And the more licenses there are, there are going to be more

11:19:27 alcohol related problems and that type of thing.

11:19:29 So one thing that came up, I think City Councilwoman Mulhern

11:19:34 brought it up is density.

11:19:36 And if there's some way to limit density in certain areas, I

11:19:40 think that would help.

11:19:41 I know there's waivers and there's all these kind of ways

11:19:45 around it.

11:19:46 But like when you have in Ybor City, SoHo, so many alcohol

11:19:49 establishments, whether they are S-1 or S-2, there's just so

11:19:53 many together you are going to have an impact on the

11:19:54 community.

11:19:55 So that's just something to consider.

11:19:59 And as far as law enforcement, the more alcohol permits and

11:20:02 licenses you have, you will need more law enforcement.

11:20:06 So that's something that we are all going to have to pay

11:20:08 for, and the city will have to provide.

11:20:11 So as far as regulation, I do agree with Chairman Miranda

11:20:18 that some type of regulation is needed.

11:20:21 I don't know what.

11:20:23 I also agree the fact that the permit and the licensing goes

11:20:26 along with the land, there's a problem.

11:20:28 And I don't know how many other cities and counties across




11:20:30 the whole state put like a time on their zoning so that it's

11:20:39 really difficult to do something like late-night permits

11:20:42 because the time might be listed right on the zoning code.

11:20:45 How can you control that?

11:20:47 But I appreciate City Council looking into this and spending

11:20:51 so much time, because as far as the community goes, we feel

11:20:53 like you are trying to look out for the health and safety of

11:20:56 the community by paying such close attention to this.

11:20:59 Thank you.

11:20:59 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: (Off microphone)

11:21:07 >> Ellen Snelling.

11:21:09 >> I'm Ingrid Smith, Parkway Avenue, Seminole Heights,

11:21:16 Tampa.

11:21:18 Tampa is a community of neighborhoods.

11:21:19 And be as such, the S-1 and S-2 concept, I like the idea of

11:21:25 the separation as far as land use, and the adverse effect on

11:21:32 the neighborhood, as Ellen said.

11:21:34 And I agree that education is the operative part when they

11:21:40 file for a permit.

11:21:41 The 2011 needs some tweaking.

11:21:47 So much in Seminole Heights, if somebody wanted neighborhood

11:21:51 support for what we would support, by midnight, till 4,

11:21:59 Thursday, Friday, Saturday

11:22:03 And now with the administrative process, they are each more

11:22:08 restricted but we don't find out anything.




11:22:18 So if they go through the administrative process, notice can

11:22:21 be sent out to the neighborhood, and talking about the

11:22:27 address on the neighborhood.

11:22:30 And as you saw, whether it's a thousand feet or 250 feet.

11:22:37 It will be beneficial if those neighborhood and especially

11:22:40 those neighborhoods impacted know this is going on, here is

11:22:44 what you can do, and if you want to support, or what the

11:22:50 appeal process is.

11:22:51 That would definitely be bushel.

11:22:54 Basically as council member Miranda said, it's not just for

11:22:57 the businesses but the community that it impact.

11:23:00 By going forward.

11:23:01 So I thank you for having this discussion.

11:23:05 And setting up the criteria.

11:23:07 But also so the neighborhood get the notice and they know

11:23:11 what the criteria are.

11:23:15 And as far as liquor, alcohol, we were at a meeting, and

11:23:27 nobody realized they had already done the wine and beer

11:23:31 because they weren't going for the hard liquor.

11:23:34 That wasn't how it was perceived by the audience that was at

11:23:39 the CRA meeting.

11:23:42 They were saying they aren't having any alcohol.

11:23:44 But because they went through the code process, nobody knew

11:23:46 that they had already been granted.

11:23:48 (Bell sounds)




11:23:49 So going forward, with 2011, the second they fill out that

11:23:54 paperwork the neighborhood needs to know, 24 hours, a letter

11:23:59 goes out with the criteria.

11:24:03 So thank you for your work on this.

11:24:05 >> Truitt Gardner, here on behalf of Wawa, and I just want

11:24:15 to give you two observations and a Don session --

11:24:19 confession.

11:24:20 Only observations you have done, Wawa rolled out throughout

11:24:25 Florida, and what I found out is if Tampa were to revert

11:24:29 back we would literally be the only injuries jurisdiction

11:24:32 that has taken this away from an administrative process, and

11:24:35 I don't think that's necessarily the direction we want to go

11:24:37 if we want to be a progressive community.

11:24:40 Secondly, I think Mrs. Montelione made this point, that if

11:24:45 we did revert back, there would be a chilling effect not

11:24:49 only on businesses, for instance, with Wawa, if they want to

11:24:54 do a statewide expansion, if there are obstacles in the way

11:24:58 they are going to choose areas that are easier to get to,

11:25:01 but would affect the entrepreneurs that are starting new

11:25:04 businesses, fanned we put up additional expenses and risks

11:25:07 and obstacles it's going to get them to go be to St. Pete

11:25:10 and other places that would really tray to work with them.

11:25:15 Then my confession, which isn't really Wawa related but I

11:25:18 think underscores a point, this is one that was approved by

11:25:22 you, the location will go nameless, but you approved it.




11:25:25 They were an operator and I personally felt bad about it.

11:25:30 But once it's done, it's done.

11:25:32 So I think Mr. Miranda, your point on this should be more

11:25:35 of -- if somebody is a bad operator, they need to be

11:25:40 punished.

11:25:40 And it's hard for me to say that, but I think also it would

11:25:45 be a great way of dealing with a situation where you don't

11:25:47 want to punish people on the front end, and they are going

11:25:50 to do the best that they can.

11:25:52 But if they are going to be bad actors, they deserve to pay

11:25:55 a price for it.

11:25:56 And I'm willing to work with council on this issue.

11:26:01 But I just wanted to get those observations and that

11:26:04 confession off my chest.

11:26:07 [ Laughter ]

11:26:11 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I'm so glad you mentioned St. Petersburg

11:26:12 because they are so progressive.

11:26:14 It is done administratively.

11:26:15 And there is a permit to serve alcohol.

11:26:20 After hours.

11:26:21 That is St. Pete's policy.

11:26:24 It is also Ft. Lauderdale's policy.

11:26:27 It is done administratively.

11:26:28 But there's a mechanism in place to be able to manage what

11:26:35 they have granted administratively.




11:26:40 >> I think theirs is perfectly fine.

11:26:45 >>YVONNE CAPIN: My sentiments exactly.

11:26:46 >> What we are seeing in local jurisdictions that are -- and

11:26:50 Mrs. Capin, you made the point earlier about your jewelry

11:26:54 store and having to get thumb prints.

11:26:57 That is the state process.

11:26:58 And what we are seeing now is a lot of local jurisdictions

11:27:01 that are given up, any jurisdictions in deferring to the

11:27:03 state, and we simply get a sign-off from them, and Pinellas

11:27:07 County at large, city of Largo, even the city of Lake Wales,

11:27:15 where they just sign off, and I think you would --

11:27:21 >> I understand.

11:27:22 If that were the case, I would very much be in favor of

11:27:25 that.

11:27:25 Unfortunately, in the past, the reason that we are doing

11:27:28 this, the reason we are here is because we have not -- those

11:27:32 tools that we have, all those ordinances that we have, it's

11:27:36 come before us.

11:27:37 It's a slap in the hand.

11:27:40 You cannot close these places down.

11:27:42 We have to buy Gene's Bar.

11:27:46 The city had to buy it.

11:27:48 We couldn't close it.

11:27:49 So now, saying, oh, just enforce what you have.

11:27:53 When they tried to enforce it, it didn't work.




11:27:55 Now, if the state wants to take it over and just bring down

11:27:59 that hammer, and -- I think that would have the essence that

11:28:07 we need in order to get rid of the bad actors.

11:28:11 There aren't that many.

11:28:12 But when they are, they do a lot of damage.

11:28:15 A lot of damage.

11:28:16 >> I agree.

11:28:21 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Thank you, Mr. Chair.

11:28:23 Mr. Gardner, did I hear you -- and I want to put this as

11:28:27 succinctly as possible.

11:28:31 In some jurisdictions, if you have a license from the State

11:28:37 of Florida, all you have to do is go to that jurisdiction,

11:28:40 fill out the paperwork, get an administrative review, and

11:28:44 you have your permit to operate within that jurisdiction?

11:28:51 >> I think we are saying the same thing, but let me give

11:28:54 you, for instance, Wawa.

11:28:56 In Pinellas County.

11:28:57 What we would do when they go to open, we are processing the

11:29:02 state application.

11:29:03 We go to the local government.

11:29:04 They check the underlying zoning that's in place, and if

11:29:10 that underlying is there, they simple will you soon off on

11:29:14 the alcohol form and get processed and approved by the

11:29:18 state.

11:29:18 >> So it is a very quick, very, I guess, painless -- and




11:29:27 there's less money for you -- but it promotes businesses in

11:29:32 that jurisdiction.

11:29:33 >> Right.

11:29:34 >> So we are talking here about doing somewhat of the

11:29:39 opposite, or at least some council members are, saying we

11:29:42 want it all to come to council.

11:29:43 >> Correct.

11:29:44 >> And I think that in order for us to have that vibrant

11:29:50 city that's welcoming to businesses, and to people moving

11:29:53 here from other places, we hope that move here from other

11:29:58 places, we need to have the least restrictive process

11:30:04 possible, and, ironed, the stick that says if you are not a

11:30:08 good operator, which is what I was trying to do last week

11:30:12 with the nightclub ordinance, if you are not a good operator

11:30:15 and you break the rules, there are going to be consequences

11:30:20 and those consequences are going to be serious.

11:30:22 >> Thinking about this this morning, I think you want to

11:30:26 provide the carrot.

11:30:28 Perhaps you want to do as council is get a bigger stick.

11:30:30 >> We just want two sticks.

11:30:34 And I saw Mrs. Kert.

11:30:37 There was something, Mrs. Kert, that you wanted to correct

11:30:40 in what was said?

11:30:41 No?

11:30:41 Okay.




11:30:43 I try and read the language.

11:30:46 All right.

11:30:46 Thank you.

11:30:46 >> Good morning.

11:30:54 My name is Carlos Caberal, live in Lisa Montelione's

11:31:03 district.

11:31:04 I'm here to speak on alcohol for two minutes.

11:31:12 And the community Ybor, SoHo, a lot of people say if this

11:31:20 ordinance goes through, especially University of South

11:31:26 Florida, university of Tampa, and even Hillsborough

11:31:28 Community College, there will be fights, there will be

11:31:31 riots, and that the City of Tampa will go under if the night

11:31:44 light ordinance falls from 3 a.m. to midnight.

11:31:48 Well, what I'm saying is, I'm not here to complain but fund

11:31:53 ways to solve problems, find ways to get everybody, all the

11:32:00 bar owners and even DJs to come together and work with

11:32:04 Councilwoman Montelione and Councilwoman Capin to find a

11:32:07 situation and solve a problem.

11:32:08 Thank you very much.

11:32:10 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

11:32:10 Anyone else?

11:32:11 >> Susan Long, 920 East Broad Street.

11:32:19 I'm torn.

11:32:20 I like the idea of making it easier, less painful to get the

11:32:26 liquor license.




11:32:27 In contrast, once you get wet zoned, you are wet zoned

11:32:31 forever.

11:32:31 And I live in a neighborhood that has worked very hard to

11:32:35 keep from being a neighborhood like SoHo, Howard.

11:32:43 We don't want people walking back and cross the street,

11:32:46 don't want them urinating in our yard, don't want them

11:32:49 throwing up drunk in our walkways.

11:32:52 But in our area right up to the commercial district.

11:32:54 It needs -- so we like to be automobile to get ahold of the

11:32:59 potential wet disowned property owners and talk to them and

11:33:03 say we would like you to do this, would like you to do that,

11:33:07 and work with them.

11:33:08 If we don't know, we can't do that.

11:33:11 And we have in a idea.

11:33:15 That bothers me.

11:33:16 Now, notice to us so that we can go ahead and say, hey,

11:33:19 these are people in your neighborhood that have applied for

11:33:21 wet zoning.

11:33:22 Some people, you know, talk about a convenience store, with

11:33:26 Aurora exceptions, there probably isn't much that we can say

11:33:30 to them.

11:33:32 A bar, there may be.

11:33:33 So I'm torn between making it easy and making it so easy

11:33:37 that our neighborhood comes apart.

11:33:39 And I don't have a quick resolution to that, and I wish I




11:33:42 do. I am going to let you guys do that.

11:33:44 How is that?

11:33:45 Thank you.

11:33:46 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you.

11:33:46 Anyone else in the audience who has not spoken who would

11:33:50 care to speak at this time?

11:33:51 Yes, ma'am.

11:33:53 >> I guess this is on.

11:33:55 Good morning.

11:33:56 Vickie Pollyea, South Moody Avenue.

11:34:00 Are we addressing the accessory uses or is that later on?

11:34:04 >> You're addressing only the first part, part A.

11:34:07 And we have gone off from A to Z, but we'll come back on A.

11:34:11 And you will be able to be speak on the others.

11:34:13 >> Regarding the S-2 process, you know, everybody wants to

11:34:19 be present and everyone wants to see the community thrive.

11:34:24 Unfortunately we have all seen what happens.

11:34:26 We just realize on making money as the criteria, what is a

11:34:32 good community?

11:34:33 We had a lovely book store on Howard Avenue.

11:34:36 It's now World of Beer.

11:34:38 And then when they came before council, said we just want to

11:34:41 serve a little wine, maybe beer and entertain.

11:34:45 And now it is not a book store anymore, it a thriving

11:34:48 business, which is wonderful, but we have to realize when we




11:34:51 make those zoning decisions, they stay, and they impact

11:34:56 forever.

11:34:57 The idea is a wonderful solution.

11:35:03 I think separate from the alcohol, that it has to do with

11:35:06 the business zone which is what was an issue you a long the

11:35:10 Howard Avenue corridor, is that to get the business owner to

11:35:19 address the usual you, not necessarily the land owners.

11:35:21 They own the bars and the restaurants.

11:35:24 My only problem with the S-1 process is there was no input

11:35:29 from the neighborhood.

11:35:30 And I have been doing this for ten years.

11:35:32 I know what is substantial, competent evidence is.

11:35:36 I know how to present fact and not just give "we don't want

11:35:40 you here."

11:35:42 There are issues that need to be addressed by neighbors,

11:35:46 that only perhaps neighbors know.

11:35:48 We need to have that option to be part of the process.

11:35:51 And the S-1, we are not.

11:35:56 Our concerns can't be addressed.

11:35:59 And I think that is the only big problem it with.

11:36:03 That and the enforcement.

11:36:05 You know, I think we can be pro business.

11:36:13 I think you can be a thriving community.

11:36:16 But you still -- listen to people and be part of the process

11:36:20 of the people that have been there for many years and care




11:36:22 about the community.

11:36:25 And I really hope that you take all of this into

11:36:28 consideration.

11:36:28 Thank you.

11:36:30 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:36:31 Anyone else who cares to speak on this item?

11:36:33 >> I promise to make this brief.

11:36:39 Ann Cury with the Westshore Alliance.

11:36:43 I really want to talk to the S-1, 1st-2 process along

11:36:47 with Ms. Snelling and Cathy Coyle.

11:36:50 We actively participated in the many, many, many discussions

11:36:53 before the ordinance of 2011, and really the S-1, we looked

11:37:00 at it as these are things that are really accessory uses, as

11:37:05 Ms. Snelling said, they are not the primary use of the

11:37:08 business.

11:37:08 I can only speak for Westshore, you know, bars cannot be

11:37:11 administratively approved.

11:37:12 But as a business center that is becoming increasingly more

11:37:17 urbanized, it's the type of use, hotels, legitimate

11:37:21 restaurants that have to meet specific state requirement,

11:37:26 convenience stores, retailers.

11:37:28 We are fully an accessory use.

11:37:31 We think the process is working pretty well.

11:37:34 Less time for council, less time for staff, less time and

11:37:37 effort for property owners to go through a process that




11:37:41 without being the 99 most of which would have been approved

11:37:45 anyway.

11:37:47 So we really think the S-1 and S-2 is working pretty well in

11:37:51 Westshore.

11:37:54 None of the Westshore neighborhoods are here today

11:37:56 necessarily.

11:37:57 I'm kind of surprised.

11:37:59 If there was an issue I'm pretty sure they would be here.

11:38:02 I think from that perspective it's working well and I ask

11:38:05 you to consider that there are different areas of the city

11:38:08 with different requirements, and the conditions that were

11:38:10 put in place as part of the S-1 process.

11:38:13 You know, that wasn't just staff coming up with that,

11:38:18 property owners coming up with that.

11:38:19 There were neighborhood representatives that participated

11:38:21 and those conditions were kind of a compromise that I think

11:38:24 everybody felt they could live with, that staff could and

11:38:28 should, you know, have the authority necessarily to approve

11:38:31 it.

11:38:32 So that's all I have to say.

11:38:33 Thank you.

11:38:34 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:38:34 Anyone else who has not spoken?

11:38:36 >> Good morning council members.

11:38:41 Grace Yang, with the Gray Robinson law firm, 401 East




11:38:45 Jackson Street in Tampa.

11:38:48 I live and work in the City of Tampa.

11:38:51 I think we enjoy great quality of Louvre here.

11:38:54 And I'm all for improving the quality of life here.

11:38:58 But I am here to speak in support of trying to keep the S-1

11:39:02 and S-2 process.

11:39:04 If there are things that council members feel need to be

11:39:07 approved, addressed and tweaked to protect our quality of

11:39:11 life and to improve our quality of life, I would rather see

11:39:15 us try to look at the S-1 and perhaps adjust some of the

11:39:20 criteria instead of completely doing away with the S-1

11:39:24 process.

11:39:25 As some of the other speakers have mentioned before, there

11:39:28 was a lot of discussion, the city organized a lot of

11:39:31 workshops before the 2011 ordinance was passed.

11:39:37 I feel like there were a lot of stockholders that

11:39:40 participated in those discussions at the workshop and that

11:39:45 the criteria that came before that come up were deliberate,

11:39:49 and they were crafted in a way to try to address the

11:39:52 concerns of a lot of different parties.

11:39:54 And so I would like to see the S-1 and S-2 continue.

11:39:58 I think there's a way that we can make it work.

11:40:01 If improvements need to be made, some adjustments to the

11:40:04 criteria, fine.

11:40:05 We can have those additional discussions.




11:40:09 For problem businesses, there are ways that we can try to

11:40:12 continue to enforce violations against them and to have you

11:40:18 process to be try to address those concerns and to get rid

11:40:21 of the bad actors in the community.

11:40:23 There are ways through our local code enforcement process

11:40:26 and hearing process, and there are ways through the state

11:40:30 through the Division of Alcoholic Beverages and tobacco

11:40:32 where they will investigate violations of alleged alcohol

11:40:36 abuses, and they will take evidence into account, and they

11:40:41 will bring forth cases and bring enforcement action, file

11:40:46 complaints against licensees and fine them or suspend or

11:40:51 revoke licenses if the evidence bears that out.

11:40:55 Thank you.

11:40:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:40:56 Next, please.

11:40:57 Anyone in the audience who has not spoken that would care to

11:41:00 speak on this part A of this item.

11:41:06 Yes.

11:41:06 >> I would like to follow up what Ms. Yang stated.

11:41:10 Mr. Michelini provided to me and I provided to council state

11:41:14 statute section 561 .29 about the state's power, about the

11:41:19 dealing with the violations of alcohol you can beverages in

11:41:23 a municipality or community and to follow up, Ms. Kert had

11:41:27 something to add.

11:41:28 >>REBECCA KERT: Legal department.




11:41:30 This isn't all 29 but it is the first part of it.

11:41:34 And also to address the request, that there was a request,

11:41:42 an effort to be responsive to that, and Ms. Yang helped me

11:41:47 get in touch with people at the state and they are very

11:41:50 willing to come down and talk to council.

11:41:52 However to travel they have to get authority from the

11:41:54 director.

11:41:54 They were willing to participate by phone but this seems to

11:41:57 be the best response if City Council would request, they

11:42:01 would be more than willing to try to accommodate City

11:42:03 Council's request.

11:42:05 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:42:06 Anyone else who has not spoken in the audience?

11:42:11 Yes, sir.

11:42:11 >>MARTIN SHELBY: There were issues raised about

11:42:13 enforcement.

11:42:14 Just so you know that it is included in the packet that you

11:42:16 have.

11:42:17 It includes section 3 -- 27-318 on page 38, so you have in

11:42:21 front of you for future reference the existing code relative

11:42:24 to enforcement.

11:42:27 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone else?

11:42:28 Okay.

11:42:28 We go to part B.

11:42:31 Now we are going to break in 20 minutes for lunch at 12:00.




11:42:35 And breakfast will be served shortly thereafter.

11:42:39 [ Laughter ]

11:42:40 Part B.

11:42:40 >>MIKE SUAREZ: I just wanted to say they'll not be

11:42:47 automobile to come back in the afternoon session if there is

11:42:49 one because I have a previous engagement.

11:42:52 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Okay.

11:42:54 That's down to five.

11:42:56 Anyone else on this item number 3?

11:43:04 This is to discuss the hotel accessory use of S-1 and S-2

11:43:09 permits.

11:43:10 Yes, sir, Mr. Shelby.

11:43:11 >> I believe that was a previous request of councilwoman

11:43:18 Mulhern, and she asked that the be placed on a future agenda

11:43:21 to discuss the concept of accessory hotel uses.

11:43:25 It did come up in discussion in part A today with regards to

11:43:28 the criteria.

11:43:29 So I don't know whether you wish to have any further

11:43:32 discussion on that.

11:43:34 >>MARY MULHERN: Are you saying we scheduled it for later or

11:43:37 not?

11:43:38 >>MARTIN SHELBY: No, actually, it was scheduled, and it was

11:43:42 put on part B of this topic.

11:43:45 But with the specific motion you made because it was related

11:43:48 to the S-1 and S-2 permits because it was a hotel accessory




11:43:53 use.

11:43:53 >>MARY MULHERN: Okay.

11:43:54 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone in the audience care to speak on

11:43:57 part B of item 3?

11:44:01 B.

11:44:02 Pleas come forward.

11:44:02 >> I have never gotten to speak twice in one morning.

11:44:09 Unbelievable.

11:44:12 Vickie Pollyea.

11:44:14 Just wanted to reiterate.

11:44:16 I mentioned before council what happens when you get over

11:44:20 100 hotel rooms is triggered also to things that I don't

11:44:24 think necessarily is the best thing for neighborhood hotels.

11:44:29 I think when the code was written, it was great where our

11:44:33 hotels were, on Westshore, on Kennedy, downtown.

11:44:36 But now we have neighborhood hotels over 100 rooms, and the

11:44:40 accessory uses, which is allowed by our city code, allows

11:44:47 what I truly believe is an unreasonable number of uses that

11:44:51 are not provided for.

11:44:53 There are over 560 banquet spaces at Bern's hotel.

11:44:59 Not one of those banquet spaces -- that's sitting around

11:45:04 having a cocktail, sitting and eating a meal, but 560

11:45:09 spaces.

11:45:09 There is not one allocated parking spot, not required by the

11:45:14 code, doesn't mach a difference how many they can have a




11:45:18 thousand spaces -- a thousand guests.

11:45:21 But the code does not specify any required parking are for

11:45:29 the guests, for staff, for anything.

11:45:30 And I truly believe when this code was written hotels were

11:45:33 imagined to be in more dense areas where there were options.

11:45:38 Howard Avenue, there are no options.

11:45:41 And, you know, one of the ways that the hotels dealt with it

11:45:47 is to require all valet parking including for Bern's, which

11:45:52 I didn't know that you could do, not have any self-park,

11:45:57 only 100% valet park, and that parking garage, structurally

11:46:02 is sound because it holding twice as many cars as what we

11:46:06 were told we were going to be in it because the valet is

11:46:09 doubling up and tripling up.

11:46:16 Bern's, and epicurean is a great addition to the city.

11:46:19 They have been responsive.

11:46:21 We have trade to work things out.

11:46:23 But for the future neighborhood and for future hotel

11:46:28 development, I would really implore you to look at the

11:46:31 accessory uses, and how they might impact the immediate

11:46:36 neighborhood transportation corridor parking issues, things

11:46:39 like that.

11:46:40 Thank you.

11:46:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Thank you very much.

11:46:42 Anyone else in the audience care to speak on part B of item

11:46:45 number 3?




11:46:47 Regarding the hotels and S-1 and S-2 use.

11:46:51 I see no one.

11:46:52 Any other comments by council members?

11:46:54 Now we go to item number 4.

11:46:57 Ms. Mulhern.

11:46:57 >>MARY MULHERN: I just want to acknowledge those comments

11:47:01 from Ms. Pollyea.

11:47:03 I'm not sure how to go forward with this because it's not

11:47:06 just relating to alcoholic beverage permits.

11:47:10 It relating to decisions by the zoning administrator about

11:47:19 substantial changes to a PD.

11:47:24 So it does apply to the alcoholic beverage permits, because

11:47:30 of the fact that those permits were S-2s instead of

11:47:37 S-1s.

11:47:38 It would have come in front of us and we would have

11:47:41 addressed, understand from -- you know, I'm not each sure --

11:47:45 I guess it the hotel itself that has the permit for the

11:47:55 overall banquet, but you have overall restaurants in there

11:47:58 and a rooftop bar.

11:47:59 So it would have come in front of us if those were not, you

11:48:04 know, hotels were not an S-1 but were an S-2.

11:48:10 So I think that would have addressed that, and we would have

11:48:15 heard -- one of the things that we have been hearing all

11:48:17 along is about from the neighborhoods, they just want to

11:48:20 have notice.




11:48:21 Well, just having notice is not going to do you any good if

11:48:24 you don't have an actual hearing and an ability to have us

11:48:29 make a decision about the zoning.

11:48:31 I mean, you can know about it.

11:48:33 But so what?

11:48:34 You are going to go to a stakeholder meeting and just be

11:48:37 told what's going to happen, because it's allowed under an

11:48:40 S-1 permit, and that's not going to solve it.

11:48:45 I mean, I'm not totally sold on us not needing more council

11:48:52 input on these alcoholic beverage permits.

11:48:55 But I also think that we need to look at substantial changes

11:48:59 to PDs and mach the definition stronger.

11:49:05 So I think that's what I need from legal, is to come back

11:49:08 with what a substantial change is.

11:49:11 So just to work on that between now and the next time we

11:49:14 have any discussion or report on this.

11:49:20 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Any others?

11:49:22 Ms. Montelione?

11:49:24 This is a workshop.

11:49:24 >>LISA MONTELIONE: The criteria for substantial changes, is

11:49:29 that the in the book?

11:49:31 >>MARTIN SHELBY: No, that's a related special use.

11:49:33 Councilwoman Mulhern is related to the PD that's a separate

11:49:36 section of the code.

11:49:38 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I think they are somewhat similar, with




11:49:40 some additions.

11:49:42 >>CATHERINE COYLE: If I could, council, what I heard Ms.

11:49:45 Pollyea talking about really is parking and those accessory

11:49:49 uses part of hotel, we don't capture parking for those

11:49:52 specific uses, banquet space and on the things.

11:49:56 Just so you know for your reference, the hotel parking ratio

11:50:00 in the city is one program, and then one per room and then a

11:50:11 half of a space per employee.

11:50:14 There is no parking ratio associated with any of those other

11:50:16 spaces that are considered accessory spaces to the hotel.

11:50:20 So we only capture parking for the room.

11:50:24 And the half space for employee.

11:50:25 >>LISA MONTELIONE: If I could follow up to that.

11:50:31 I think some of the premise behind that is when you have a

11:50:34 conference at a hotel.

11:50:35 Oftentimes, not people staying at the hotel are attending

11:50:41 that conference.

11:50:42 So that brings another additional cost.

11:50:47 You are already capturing the vehicle that is assigned to

11:50:50 that room, for that person who is probably attending that

11:50:55 conference.

11:50:55 So I think we get back to mass transit again.

11:51:01 Because --

11:51:04 >> It's a city-wide standard, with the exception of Ybor,

11:51:07 downtown, Channelside.




11:51:09 >>LISA MONTELIONE: And the on the thing with hotels, too,

11:51:11 is they often provide vans or multi-passenger vehicles to

11:51:17 ferry folks back and forth, say, from the Tampa Convention

11:51:20 Center to a hotel that may be nearby.

11:51:24 So I think that there's reasoning behind the code that says

11:51:30 we don't capture the capacity of a meeting room.

11:51:35 Able.

11:51:36 >>CATHERINE COYLE: I think about two or three month ago we

11:51:38 actually had a workshop on substantial changes.

11:51:41 I believe we already talked about that in the past.

11:51:44 I can provide the criteria again if you would like, Ms.

11:51:47 Mulhern.

11:51:48 >>MARY MULHERN: Well, I would like to see that.

11:51:51 But I think that we need to see that because I think we need

11:51:57 to change the criteria.

11:51:58 And I think what you just said, you illustrated the problem

11:52:01 that when you look at hotel, you adopt look at the accessory

11:52:04 uses and what parking requirements those are going to bring.

11:52:11 That's what it sounded like to me.

11:52:13 You only loom at the hotel.

11:52:15 Now it looking at the accessory.

11:52:17 >>CATHERINE COYLE: That ratio has been in place for a very

11:52:19 long time.

11:52:20 >>MARY MULHERN: So we need to work on that, I think.

11:52:23 That will help a lot but I think we also need to look at




11:52:25 what a substantial change is.

11:52:27 I would like to make a motion that we put that on as a staff

11:52:32 report, or separate workshop.

11:52:35 Maybe a separate workshop.

11:52:37 >>HARRY COHEN: I think the reason we have to talk about

11:52:47 that is because people come up to us all the time, and they

11:52:49 say, why did you approve that?

11:52:51 And, in fact, it's oftentimes something that we haven't

11:52:55 approved.

11:52:59 So it's very, very important that we feel comfortable that

11:53:01 the criteria is such that we can explain why we gave away

11:53:06 the power to decide where the curb cuts are going to go,

11:53:12 and, you know, really details, the details that we consider

11:53:18 when we are looking at a PD.

11:53:20 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Ms. Coyle, you said check with the

11:53:34 clerk, and Debby is looking at me here.

11:53:36 Didn't we just discuss this criteria?

11:53:40 >>CATHERINE COYLE: It was part of another discussion,

11:53:42 embedded within another discussion, a run-on sentence in the

11:53:45 motion about substantial changes.

11:53:47 >>LISA MONTELIONE: If the motion is for a workshop, I am

11:53:53 not going to support a motion for a workshop because we just

11:53:57 recently discussed this criteria. On staff report, I

11:54:00 probably would be fine with a staff report but another full

11:54:03 blown workshop oh for a discussion that we just recently




11:54:06 had, I don't think is necessary, and I think we are talking

11:54:10 about the same thing over and over again.

11:54:13 So that's what I would like to say that.

11:54:16 I don't know if the clerk has come up with be a date suns we

11:54:21 just talked about this.

11:54:24 But if we didn't come up with something out of the last time

11:54:27 we discussed it, you know, I don't think we need a

11:54:31 full-blown workshop to discuss it again.

11:54:33 >>MARY MULHERN: I just want top loop at the regulations and

11:54:42 see if we can mach them better.

11:54:43 It I don't matter to me if it's a staff report or workshop.

11:54:47 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: You want a staff report, and your motion

11:54:49 seconded by Mr. Cohen.

11:54:50 Correct?

11:54:51 Regarding -- tell me in the Mike so the clerk can record it

11:54:55 and we know exactly what we are doing.

11:54:58 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Cohen cope I believe we have a motion for

11:55:02 a staff report.

11:55:03 I was going to suggest May 15th at 10 a.m.

11:55:10 >>MARY MULHERN: A staff report, the code for substantial

11:55:15 changes to a PD.

11:55:18 But I also think we may want to talk about hotels that is

11:55:25 specific, not just hotel, but included discussion of hotels,

11:55:33 and substantial changes to hotels, supposedly, just to mach

11:55:37 sure we capture what the specific problem was about.




11:55:43 >>CATHERINE COYLE: If I could ask council.

11:55:46 I am going to be discussing hotel. I don't know what to

11:55:49 provide you other than the criteria.

11:55:50 And then you will have to ask me questions, I guess.

11:55:54 Just provide us with the current--

11:55:56 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mrs. Mulhern, second

11:55:59 by Mr. Cohen.

11:56:00 Further discussions?

11:56:00 >>HARRY COHEN: May 15th at 9 a.m.

11:56:17 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mrs. Mulhern.

11:56:19 Second by Mr. Cohen.

11:56:20 Further discussion by council members?

11:56:22 All in favor?

11:56:23 Opposed?

11:56:24 Motion passes unanimously.

11:56:25 All right.

11:56:26 We are getting to that hour close to 12:00.

11:56:29 We are going to have to come back.

11:56:31 Let me tell you this.

11:56:32 I have two council members who won't be here.

11:56:34 You can tell you that I am stacked from 2:30 all the way to

11:56:38 6:00 today, three events right after that.

11:56:41 So I will be here but I won't be here for long.

11:56:43 So we are going to come back at 1:30.

11:56:46 Hopefully we can get this done.




11:56:48 Any others?

11:56:49 Thank you very much for attending.

11:56:51 We stand in recess till 1:30.

01:29:37 >> (Recess)














































01:29:37 (Following recess:)

01:30:04 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: City Council is called to order.

01:36:16 Roll call.

01:36:18 >>YVONNE CAPIN: Present.

01:36:20 >>HARRY COHEN: Here.

01:36:21 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Here.

01:36:23 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Here.

01:36:24 Well, I know that we still have items, a couple, two or

01:36:28 three items left on the agenda.

01:36:29 But I also know that we only have four members.

01:36:32 And I also know that some of these members including myself

01:36:34 have -- not all of us, some of us, have to be somewhere

01:36:38 else.

01:36:41 We can continue this till another date.

01:36:44 In the meantime, start thinking of what we are going to do

01:36:48 to fix these problems.

01:36:50 Yes, sir?

01:36:52 >>HARRY COHEN: I just want to say that there are two

01:36:55 workshops scheduled between now and our summer break, May

01:36:59 and June.

01:37:00 The one in May only has a comp plan amendment in the medical

01:37:04 marijuana issue on it and one in June has nothing on it so

01:37:08 far as I can tell.

01:37:09 Others are ceremonial activity.

01:37:11 I also wanted to ask if we can also mach sure we do new




01:37:15 business before we adjourn.

01:37:17 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: All right.

01:37:20 Ms. Montelione.

01:37:21 >>LISA MONTELIONE: You are asking me if May is all right.

01:37:26 And the way I feel is that today should have been all right.

01:37:29 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I understand that but --

01:37:31 >>LISA MONTELIONE: And, you know, it's not once, not twice,

01:37:35 it's been a dozen or more times that we have council members

01:37:38 who don't come back after lunch, or seem to have scheduling

01:37:42 issues.

01:37:45 It's a Thursday.

01:37:46 And unless you are, you know, out of town, I have had to go

01:37:51 to Tallahassee on Thursdays, as all of us have had

01:37:56 tragedies, death in the family or something like that.

01:37:58 But, you know, I prefer that we hear it today.

01:38:02 I have had workshops before with only three people and they

01:38:05 are called special discussion sessions.

01:38:08 I think that the public is worn out.

01:38:13 We have the same issue.

01:38:15 PD is only here, planned developments, and people ask us to

01:38:18 continue it, continue, continue, and we get upset with them

01:38:22 because you wear out the public, they stop showing up, they

01:38:25 can't make it back after lunch, they are tired of coming

01:38:28 down here, listening to us talk about the same project.

01:38:32 So I think it's a disservice to the public for us to




01:38:38 continue this and continue this and continue this and

01:38:39 continue this.

01:38:41 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Well, then I am going to be on the side

01:38:44 of the public because on the public side PD advised me that

01:38:48 they had to leave at 2:00.

01:38:49 They have an assignment, and also I have got other duties.

01:38:55 I also see some of the same people we just mentioned or you

01:38:58 just mentioned that are in this business can't be here, and

01:39:01 they have also asked that we continue.

01:39:05 So, you know, people leave.

01:39:08 I don't go to Tallahassee at all.

01:39:10 In fact, I don't even like the place.

01:39:16 I understand.

01:39:16 The only thing -- and not that I am anti- anything but

01:39:24 people have different things to do at different times.

01:39:26 I would imagine those that are not here, not to not be

01:39:35 responsive to the needs but they figure this was going to be

01:39:37 over with by noon.

01:39:39 Well, they are wrong.

01:39:39 And people do the scheduling.

01:39:41 And sometimes you do, sometimes you don't.

01:39:43 But on the other side, most members are here most of the

01:39:47 time.

01:39:48 Most members that are not here, they are not coming, they do

01:39:51 send a letter.




01:39:52 And I give it to the clerk's office, and I make the

01:39:55 announcement.

01:39:57 So I have done all I can to accommodate the system on both

01:40:00 sides.

01:40:01 So that's all I am going to say.

01:40:05 What do you all want to do?

01:40:09 >>HARRY COHEN: We have two dates.

01:40:11 We have May 22nd, and June 19th.

01:40:15 Both of which are workshop days.

01:40:17 Both of which have plenty of time available on the calendar.

01:40:22 There's items number 5, 6 and 7.

01:40:24 >>LISA MONTELIONE: I'm sorry, Mr. Chair.

01:40:32 Plenty of time on the calendar in May.

01:40:34 But we had plenty of time on the calendar today.

01:40:37 >>HARRY COHEN: Number 7, continued to May 22nd for 5 and

01:40:44 number 6 be continued to June 19 at 9:00 a.m.

01:40:51 Number 7 is a quick one.

01:40:53 And it's design exception.

01:40:58 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: I have a motion by Mr. Cohen.

01:41:01 Second by Capin.

01:41:03 Discussion by council members?

01:41:04 All in favor?

01:41:05 Opposed?

01:41:06 Motion passes unanimously.

01:41:08 New business.




01:41:09 We go right to left.

01:41:10 >>HARRY COHEN: Item number 5 and number 6 are going to be

01:41:17 discussed on our workshop session on June 19th at 9:00

01:41:22 a.m.

01:41:24 Ceremonial activities.

01:41:25 And item number 7 will be discussed on May 22nd, following

01:41:30 the discussion of medical marijuana.

01:41:37 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Did everyone understand that?

01:41:38 All right.

01:41:38 >>HARRY COHEN: 9 a.m.

01:41:50 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Where was I at?

01:41:53 Are you going to be here, Ms. Coyle?

01:42:02 You aren't going to be in Tallahassee, are you?

01:42:06 >>CATHERINE COYLE: (off microphone).

01:42:11 >>HARRY COHEN: Which of the two dates is problematic?

01:42:17 >>CATHERINE COYLE: (off microphone) but ... the discussion

01:42:27 and Ms. Calloway is coming back on the 14th so she will

01:42:31 be here.

01:42:31 It's a brief overview.

01:42:35 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: We understand.

01:42:37 Mrs. Capin, new business.

01:42:39 >>YVONNE CAPIN: I don't have anything.

01:42:40 >>HARRY COHEN: Two items, Mr. Chair.

01:42:42 First of all, I would like to make a motion for City Council

01:42:45 commendation to be presented to the Florida trust, Florida




01:42:49 historic preservation society in conjunction with their

01:42:53 annual members luncheon to be held at the Columbia

01:42:57 restaurant on May 15, 2014.

01:43:01 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mr. Cohen, second by Mrs.

01:43:03 Capin.

01:43:04 All in favor?

01:43:05 The ayes have it unanimously.

01:43:06 >>HARRY COHEN: And second, I would like to ask us to invite

01:43:11 our tax collector, the honorable Doug Belton to come to City

01:43:15 Council to receive a commendation honoring him for receiving

01:43:18 the Simmons good government award which was a very big honor

01:43:24 bestowed on him yesterday by the county commission.

01:43:27 We will ask for a date that can be coordinated with his

01:43:29 office.

01:43:29 >> Second.

01:43:31 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mr. Cohen, seconded by Mrs.

01:43:33 Montelione.

01:43:34 Further discussion by council members?

01:43:35 All in favor of the motion?

01:43:37 Opposed?

01:43:38 The ayes have it unanimously.

01:43:39 >>LISA MONTELIONE: Yes, sir.

01:43:43 Speaking of Tallahassee and alcohol in the same sentence,

01:43:47 our legislature is considering changing a piece of

01:43:51 legislation that would affect the craft beer industry.




01:43:56 We have many wonderful success stories of breweries opening

01:44:01 up in our city.

01:44:02 And I would ask council's favor to have Mr. Shelby compose a

01:44:09 letter to our legislative delegation saying that we support

01:44:14 our craft brewery industry and asking them not to include

01:44:19 the provisions that would disturb or -- disturb new places

01:44:29 opening and the existing establishments doing business.

01:44:36 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion by Mrs. Montelione.

01:44:37 Seconded by Mrs. Capin.

01:44:39 All in favor of the motion?

01:44:41 Opposed?

01:44:41 The ayes have it unanimously.

01:44:43 Anything else?

01:44:44 >>LISA MONTELIONE: That's it.

01:44:45 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Anyone in the audience care to address

01:44:47 this council?

01:44:51 Thank you for your time.

01:44:53 Anyone of the 512?

01:44:55 I see no one.

01:44:59 Item number 4?

01:45:05 >>HARRY COHEN:

01:45:08 >>MARTIN SHELBY: Was finished this morning.

01:45:11 >> Motion to receive and file.

01:45:12 >>CHARLIE MIRANDA: Motion to receive and file by Mr. Cohen.

01:45:14 Seconded by Mrs. Capin.




01:45:16 All in favor of the motion to receive and file?

01:45:18 Opposed?

01:45:18 The ayes have it unanimously.

01:45:20 We stand adjourned.

01:45:24 >> (Meeting adjourned.)



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